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Author Topic: I like the dark age... and not afraid to admit it.  (Read 5117 times)

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JPArbiter

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I like the dark age... and not afraid to admit it.
« on: June 07, 2012, 11:55:13 PM »

So here is the thing.  I have been a fan of battletech since I was 9 years old, so the early nineties.  it was the cartoon of all things that brought me to it.  since then I was hooked, and now have been reading novels, sourcebooks and playing ever since.  when fasa closed their doors in 2001, I was saddened that my favorite hobby was disappearing, but it would never make me give up my books.

so when I found out Wizkids was recreating mechwarrior in a new way I was thrilled.  when I saw the product under development, I admit I was confused.  the thoroughly advanced timeline, the stark visual difference in mech design, some battle armor I never heard of (Clan Battle Armor is not Elemental suitm abnd I did not even know what a Hauberk was!)

still I gave the game a chance, because some mech action was better then no mech action.  I bought two starters and a booster, Pulling a Swordsworn centurion, an modified forestry mech, and the Spirit Cat Arbalest. when I played the demo I was hooked.  the game was easier to pick up then the board game ever was, much faster paced.  sure flaws developed over time, like how for a third of the games life cycle mechs were big targets and a point sink.  but it was still great.

but what drew me in was the same as what drew me into battletech proper.  the Fiction.  while many complained about the old guard being gone, I was gobbling up the new heros being born.  Tara Campbell, Anastasia Kerensky, Erik Sandoval, Evan Kurst were all well doen characters.  they were only a taste of what was to come with Jullian Davion, Callandre Kell, Alaric Wolf, and the most well developed and three dimensional character in all of battletech Danai Liao Centrella came to be.

while early fluff introduced this new kid faction, we see its rapid downfall under the absence of it's founding father.  we see a once proud clan the emphasized calm battle prowess and professionalism descend into madness.  The Draconis Combine falls down to the worst civic strife since the Von Rhors Coordinators.

this is interesting stuff for me, not the same old same old war, new conflicts, new strife, new problems, and the character and makeup of factions are shaken to their core.

 This all left me wondering what was not to love about the period, and the best answer I can get is because it was suddenly sprung on us, rather the eased in, it became way to offputting to most.  am I that far off?
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masterarminas

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Re: I like the dark age... and not afraid to admit it.
« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2012, 12:27:35 AM »

I started played before the 4th Succession War was released.  My heart belongs in the 3025 era.  Then we had Michael Stackpole and he turned the universe on its ear.  House Liao was nearly destroyed, two states joined together in an Alliance that threatened the status quo.  Still, it could have been good, but NO.

NO, the writers gave us that stupid 20 year leap forward.  We didn't get a chance to digest or play in the 3039 era or experience the war; suddenly there was the Clans!  Everything changed!  And the universe blinked.  Previously written material (the SOURCE material) was changed, it was altered, it was retconned.  The Northwind Highlanders had never actually been a Liao House unit--ignore that first sourcebook.  No, they were always mercs.  Oh, these SLDF 'Mechs; they weren't extinct.  Heavens forbid!  Instead, they were downgraded, but the chassis's have been there all the time.  Oh look.  The Taurians are now ALL paranoid instead of having a paranoid ruler.  Must be the Hyades radiation.

And then they did it again.  We skipped forward with a rapid series of books that eliminated the Smoke Jaguars, ended the Clan invasion, formed a New Star League, somehow the Cappies come back to life, Victor Steiner-Davion (the hero of the Clan front) loses his thrones and become Precentor-Martial.  WHAT?

And it didn't stop.  WoB goes from being a minor ComStar faction to a super-power with hidden armies and fleets; the leaders of the Inner Sphere become utter idiots who are all caught offguard and planets burn.  Established characters (love them or hate them) are killed off left and right, the Concordat splits apart and use nukes because they apparently lose their mind and invade the Fed Suns!  Meanwhile, the Clans completely forget their Clans and it must be something in the water:  they go crazy and make the Jihad look like some kids playing patty-cake!

And then we leap forward again!  Suddenly there is this nobody named Devlin Stone who has convinced everyone else to disarm and reformed the Terran Hegemony:  oh, wait, the Republic of the Sphere.  But then something goes wrong, the Republic abandons its outer planets and people haul old 'Mechs out of storage and put guns on industrial units and go back to shooting each other up!  The few remaining Clans in the IS seem to have NO idea of what Clan society and culture is anymore and ARE worse than dezgra barbarians--they are mongols.  Making a desert and calling it peace.

Look, I don't mind change.  If it comes slowly and FITS into the world setting.  But these people have so screwed up my BattleTech that I don't recogonize the game anymore.  I have no empathy for the current timeline what so ever.  So I ignore it.  I go back and play my 3025 era stuff when the universe made sense.  I play around a bit with early 3050 era stuff, just because the original IDEA of the Clans is cool.

But past 3060 or so?  I don't play.

Master Arminas

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Dread Moores

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Re: I like the dark age... and not afraid to admit it.
« Reply #2 on: June 08, 2012, 07:14:28 AM »

Look, I don't mind change.  If it comes slowly and FITS into the world setting.  But these people have so screwed up my BattleTech that I don't recogonize the game anymore.

Considering that the original creators (who wrote the hallowed SOURCE material) were involved in the earliest point of change that you disliked...it's hard to see how you don't mind change. It also completely ignores the fact that the source material was changed by the original creators long before they even reached the Clan Invasion. There is a distinct change, before even the 4th Succession War, when the creators realized that the 3rd Succession War was a completely unplayable setting in the long term. No new construction (as the era was initially described) meant the game would die a slow death. But that's a point for another topic, and it has been covered well elsewhere.

This setting has evolved many times. Most of them were to offer up pieces that would draw in a larger and more varied fan base. They've been pretty successful in that regard. Not all of them were handled or introduced well. I'd put the Dark Age in that category. I'd also put the hallowed Star League in that category. The initial implementation of the Star League (including the revered Star League sourcebook) is pretty terrible tripe. As gaps have been filled in, and fans developed their own thoughts, it has come alive. The same thing has happened with most eras since, including the Dark Age. I've still enjoyed the heck out of those eras, even when they were badly caricatured pulp at their inception. Far more of this game's evolution has been set by outside development factors (the split of Weisman/Lewis/Babcock, Stackpole leaving, the closing of FASA, etc.) than actual in-game content. So it's pretty hard to judge the content in a bubble without keeping those things in mind.

Every era has its fans and its critics. That won't ever change. The only thing that bugs me about any era's critics are when uninformed views are put forward as fact, all while diluting far more complicated points into modern news media style talking points. Well that and the whole "there's only one TRUE battletech! My Battletech!" philosophy. That's maddening. If you're not willing to look deep enough to see the big picture *and* the gritty details, you won't find much you like about...well, anything in life. It's not hard to find interesting facets in every era of BT. Personally, I find more of them in the Jihad and Dark Age setting, as most of the one-dimensional caricatures that made up the earliest materials and factions have dropped away.
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MadCapellan

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Re: I like the dark age... and not afraid to admit it.
« Reply #3 on: June 08, 2012, 09:52:36 AM »

The clickytech game was god-awful, and not simply because it was vastly different from Battletech, or because the miniatures had a horrible sense of scale (Gah!), but because it was absolutely mind-numbingly broken in dozens of ways.  BattleMechs were useless except as battering-rams performing charge attacks, single infantry squads could pin 100 ton combat vehicles, and each expansion introduced a new, broken piece of munchtech that you had to have to win worse than Warhammer 40K.

Despite the fact that I despise the game, the fiction, however, particularly after the first two or three boring, Republic focused novels, was absolutely excellent, and I like the direction the universe has taken.  Honestly Master Arminas, the Dark Age resembles Succession Wars era Battletech more than any other era since.
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Dragon Cat

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Re: I like the dark age... and not afraid to admit it.
« Reply #4 on: June 08, 2012, 01:02:17 PM »

I'd agree with what has said the game was horrible but the actual time period fiction was quite decent - eventually.

The game suffered from so many flaws I was glad when FanPro (at the time) introduced the first Record Sheet book for the DA era and it had descriptions of the Clan Battle Armour the Hauberk and some of the designs of the period - it gave me a "BattleTech" sized opening into the time period.

Me and a couple of friends at the time played BattleTech games in the era mixing units like they did in the Click game and we agreed it was workable, particularly remember having a Spirit Cat Arbalest, A pair of Jousts, a pair of SM1s and some Clan Battle Armour all Spirit Cat Colours as my favorite Star.

Then as the fiction continued and we began to see deeper into the Republic, and Terra itself I really liked it.  The new characters that were introduced, the story lines even the Caleb/Danai story line was a bold direction.  Then unfortunately IMO the universe let itself down with Fortress Republic, there were far better ways for them to do it but instead they gave the Republic a "shield" that blocked anyway for anyone to get into it which was seriously messed up.

Personally considering the way that Catalyst ended the Jihad and dealt with the War of Reaving I'm really looking forward to where they go in the future.
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Really, as long as there is an unbroken line of people calling themselves "Clan Nova Cat," it doesn't really matter to me if they're still using Iron Wombs or not. They may be dead as a faction, but as a people they still exist. It's not uncommon in the real world, after all.

Cestusrex

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Re: I like the dark age... and not afraid to admit it.
« Reply #5 on: June 08, 2012, 07:40:32 PM »

You had to bring up the #@$* @*^% #$%@ mother #$^& !@%$ son of #$^@ #*%@ing ERA-THAT-SHALL-NOT-BE-NAMED! >:(  ANGUS!  FIRE UP THE CESTUS!  SOMEONE NEEDS A GAUSS SLUG THROAT LOZENGE! Just kidding.
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Gabriel

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Re: I like the dark age... and not afraid to admit it.
« Reply #6 on: June 08, 2012, 07:53:12 PM »

If you think he is kidding I have some lovely land southwest of bermuda. Always sunny no strange weather
« Last Edit: June 08, 2012, 07:58:10 PM by Gabriel »
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Dread Moores

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Re: I like the dark age... and not afraid to admit it.
« Reply #7 on: June 08, 2012, 08:41:01 PM »

If you think he is kidding I have some lovely land southwest of bermuda. Always sunny no strange weather

Oh, I don't think he's kidding. But it's still hysterical and cute.
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Rainbow 6

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Re: I like the dark age... and not afraid to admit it.
« Reply #8 on: June 09, 2012, 06:12:30 PM »

3025 will always be my home in terms of Battletech, i'd have been happier though if TPTB had moved the timeline in a proper progression instead of the 20 year jump and not messed up the whole Northwind Highlander history.
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Blacknova

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Re: I like the dark age... and not afraid to admit it.
« Reply #9 on: June 09, 2012, 06:15:20 PM »

Yeah, 3020-3055 is my favorite times, somewhat obvious from the KU.  I also like the good old days, anything from the AoW forward.  I think once Victor got a real chance to whine I kind of tuned out a bit.
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Re: I like the dark age... and not afraid to admit it.
« Reply #10 on: June 09, 2012, 06:18:47 PM »

My personal favorite was the Clan invasion era just before Bulldog and Serpent kicked off and the Clans got royally screwed over.

The Clans really changed things up for me I was slowly getting bored with the Succession Era lack of new tech and new Mech.  The Clan War brought some of my favorite things into the game

WarShips
Clan Tech
Clan Nova Cat (lol)

Never really looked back from then.  Hated the Jihad when it started but slowly began to really enjoy it.

At the moment though I'm hating 3085 in my AU as I can't seem to find motivation to get passed it
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Really, as long as there is an unbroken line of people calling themselves "Clan Nova Cat," it doesn't really matter to me if they're still using Iron Wombs or not. They may be dead as a faction, but as a people they still exist. It's not uncommon in the real world, after all.

Blacknova

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Re: I like the dark age... and not afraid to admit it.
« Reply #11 on: June 09, 2012, 06:20:03 PM »

Stabilise and then time jump a decade
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Dragon Cat

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Re: I like the dark age... and not afraid to admit it.
« Reply #12 on: June 09, 2012, 06:32:54 PM »

Stabilise and then time jump a decade

The ideas are there I just keep finding other projects to work on have about 4 working at the moment in various states also work sapping my will to live... i mean write, I'm doing bits and pieces with it, just need to get head down and do something about it.

Today was my first purchase of CBT stuff since War of Reaving and Prototypes came out!!  KU Clans is slowly bringing me back into CBT which is kinda amusing since it's an AU Project!!

Good thing is my stuff isn't going anywhere so when it's time will just jump back in.
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My stuff, and my AU timeline follow link and enjoy

http://www.ourbattletech.com/forum/dragon-cat-collection/

The original CBT thread
Dragon Cat on CBT


Really, as long as there is an unbroken line of people calling themselves "Clan Nova Cat," it doesn't really matter to me if they're still using Iron Wombs or not. They may be dead as a faction, but as a people they still exist. It's not uncommon in the real world, after all.

Gabriel

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Re: I like the dark age... and not afraid to admit it.
« Reply #13 on: June 10, 2012, 09:31:07 AM »

Okay Dr Who where is the TARDIS so we can timejump a decade
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Re: I like the dark age... and not afraid to admit it.
« Reply #14 on: June 10, 2012, 09:38:26 AM »

The storyline for BattleTech just broke down for me along the way and Dark Ages was so poorly introduced it is impossible for me to follow. I have no doubt that the characters are interesting and the plot is being well developed now but the horses have left the barn for me. If it were up to me I'd reboot the entire franchise.
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