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Author Topic: Inner Sphere Armed Forces Handbook  (Read 1945 times)

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panzerfaust150

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Inner Sphere Armed Forces Handbook
« on: December 14, 2012, 12:20:20 PM »

Hi all,
 Am starting this new thread for development and to separate it out from the "If you could design a sourcebook thread".

 I think first, it might be a good idea to come up with WHEN we're setting this idea. The Davions of 3025 are a very different monster from those of 3075. Equipment changes, which can affect doctrine, or vice versa.

 So, let's get the bare bones together, then we'll begin to work up ideas on how to proceed.

   
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Ice Hellion

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Re: Inner Sphere Armed Forces Handbook
« Reply #1 on: December 14, 2012, 12:34:32 PM »

Could you be a little more precise?
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panzerfaust150

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Re: Inner Sphere Armed Forces Handbook
« Reply #2 on: December 14, 2012, 01:21:50 PM »

What I am looking to do is this:

  I want to first decide what era we are doing this book for. After? We decide whether or not we're mentioning the periphery, or just the major powers.

  Next? I then want to do a sample writeup to show folks what we're trying to achieve here, and then assign people to do various nations as they 1) wish and 2) we have space to assign. I don't want to do more than three people a section so we don't have a billion cooks in the broth here.

   
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SSJGohan3972

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Re: Inner Sphere Armed Forces Handbook
« Reply #3 on: December 14, 2012, 01:43:39 PM »

Well the time frame should probably be the one most people are interested in, many people on this forum seem to lean towards the earlier time frames (3025, 3050, etc.) doing it in 3085/3095 ie 'current' would be interesting to me but I'd also be interested and willing to contribute to an earlier timeframe. What one do you think would be best panzer?

While I am a huge periphery fan and would love to see your take on the Taurians, Marians, Magistracy, Outworlds, etc. I think the houses are more important to get through first.
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Minerva12345

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Re: Inner Sphere Armed Forces Handbook
« Reply #4 on: December 14, 2012, 02:04:24 PM »

First and foremost each and every serious military is based on following lineage:

1) From NATO to Western Alliance.
The framework of Western Alliance forces is essentially multinational NATO forces that existed for Southern Flank for Cold War (under AFSOUTH). When Second Soviet Civil War is finally over the new military structure is multinational but very similar to current NATO ready unit serving in Mediterranean Sea.

Tone: Cold War sensibilities of nuclear confrontation and massive tank armies should be norm alongside enormous expenditures to high tech forces.

Intensity: Mid-level

2) From Western Alliance to Terran Hegemony
Here the forces differ. Ten iconic forces are formed due wars of national liberation or result of internal chaos. Here the military structures again do not necessarily change but units get less elaborate initially.

When armies turn into more professional force they again follow the tradition of Western Alliance for their staff and command systems (G-1 to G-8 etc, combined signals and HQ units etc) but with similar force structure to modern NATO armies (especially France is excellent study target) that assume mantle of ability to fight expeditionary wars. Essentially they all should have heavy administrative structure at home and tailored task force structure for expeditions.

Tone: Ironically both occupiers and occupied play the same game book of expeditionary warfare. The key here is tailored task forces and large staffs to support them in complex continuum of both peace keeping and guerilla war.

Intensity: Low-Intensity

3) From Terran Hegemony to Star League
The above mentioned administrative and staff structures continue to flourish and get truly massive as interstellar nations become ever richer and better armed and ultimately the arms races make their expeditionary forces (and task forces) ridiculously large.

Tone: This is essentially similar to arms race before First World War. The forces are huge and tone is nothing short of belligerent. Superpower confrontations and tense atmosphere should be key.

Intensity: Low (to few Medium-scale) conflicts.

4) From Amaris to Second Succession War
The nuclear confrontation leads to massive casualties and forces new thinking. Expeditionary forces adopt more flexible organization structures at all levels and return back to nuclear age sensibilities (perhaps more support should be area rather than unit based).

Tone: The nuclear warfare is similar to WW2 prepared attacks (so we know pretty well how units deal with massive casualties). The flexibility and dispersal requirements mean more responsibility at junior levels that causes internal frictions. The WW3 fantasies written in 1970's should also give good ideas to feeling.

Intensity: High intensity (and later medium-intensity).

5) From Third Succession War to Fourth Succession War
The continuous fall of military potential and whole-scale collapse of civil order lead again to rise of local warlords centered around warrior aristocracy. This leads to further division of military forces to local actors and subsequently leads to increase of liaison and alliance mechanisms inside military forces themselves.

Tone: Ossified (and perhaps grossly overmanned) military structures clinging to their hey day could be used to great effect here. However, structures rely still on same fighting techniques of Second Succession War but at far less scale. Division of military force should lead to smaller scale conflicts and ultimately tacitly approved private wars.

Intensity: Medium to Light intensity.

6) Future wars... perhaps another time

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panzerfaust150

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Re: Inner Sphere Armed Forces Handbook
« Reply #5 on: December 14, 2012, 03:19:36 PM »

First and foremost each and every serious military is based on following lineage:

1) From NATO to Western Alliance.
The framework of Western Alliance forces is essentially multinational NATO forces that existed for Southern Flank for Cold War (under AFSOUTH). When Second Soviet Civil War is finally over the new military structure is multinational but very similar to current NATO ready unit serving in Mediterranean Sea.

Tone: Cold War sensibilities of nuclear confrontation and massive tank armies should be norm alongside enormous expenditures to high tech forces.

Intensity: Mid-level


Might want to throw in AFNORTH and AFCENT.

Quote
2) From Western Alliance to Terran Hegemony
Here the forces differ. Ten iconic forces are formed due wars of national liberation or result of internal chaos. Here the military structures again do not necessarily change but units get less elaborate initially.

When armies turn into more professional force they again follow the tradition of Western Alliance for their staff and command systems (G-1 to G-8 etc, combined signals and HQ units etc) but with similar force structure to modern NATO armies (especially France is excellent study target) that assume mantle of ability to fight expeditionary wars. Essentially they all should have heavy administrative structure at home and tailored task force structure for expeditions.

Tone: Ironically both occupiers and occupied play the same game book of expeditionary warfare. The key here is tailored task forces and large staffs to support them in complex continuum of both peace keeping and guerilla war.

Intensity: Low-Intensity


Other forces to look at are the USMC's way of doing things, perhaps airborne forces and then perhaps for the occupied going with the Maoist "People's War" model without the politics or the Swiss/Israeli "armed nation" concept.

Quote
3) From Terran Hegemony to Star League
The above mentioned administrative and staff structures continue to flourish and get truly massive as interstellar nations become ever richer and better armed and ultimately the arms races make their expeditionary forces (and task forces) ridiculously large.

Tone: This is essentially similar to arms race before First World War. The forces are huge and tone is nothing short of belligerent. Superpower confrontations and tense atmosphere should be key.

Intensity: Low (to few Medium-scale) conflicts.

This is also a good starting point, with a throw back to the NATO-WP era as well.

Quote
4) From Amaris to Second Succession War
The nuclear confrontation leads to massive casualties and forces new thinking. Expeditionary forces adopt more flexible organization structures at all levels and return back to nuclear age sensibilities (perhaps more support should be area rather than unit based).

Tone: The nuclear warfare is similar to WW2 prepared attacks (so we know pretty well how units deal with massive casualties). The flexibility and dispersal requirements mean more responsibility at junior levels that causes internal frictions. The WW3 fantasies written in 1970's should also give good ideas to feeling.

Intensity: High intensity (and later medium-intensity).

Agreed, and this might be where most of what we know and love from units in CBT stem from.

Quote
5) From Third Succession War to Fourth Succession War
The continuous fall of military potential and whole-scale collapse of civil order lead again to rise of local warlords centered around warrior aristocracy. This leads to further division of military forces to local actors and subsequently leads to increase of liaison and alliance mechanisms inside military forces themselves.

Tone: Ossified (and perhaps grossly overmanned) military structures clinging to their hey day could be used to great effect here. However, structures rely still on same fighting techniques of Second Succession War but at far less scale. Division of military force should lead to smaller scale conflicts and ultimately tacitly approved private wars.

Intensity: Medium to Light intensity.

That works very well, we could do a real tension between the feudal model, and the more technological basis to keep the entire machine running. I like this...

« Last Edit: December 14, 2012, 03:20:36 PM by panzerfaust150 »
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drakensis

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Re: Inner Sphere Armed Forces Handbook
« Reply #6 on: December 15, 2012, 02:49:36 AM »

Throwing out some more ideas.

The SLDF staff structure (according to one little sidebar on pg.12 of FM: SLDF) was based on the German model (Ia, Ib, Ic, IIa, etc.) rather than the US model (CoS, S-1, S-2, S-3, etc) which I think is derived from the French model (but I could be wrong) and between the War of Davion Succession and the First Succession War the Federated Suns set up a militia system based on the Prussian Landwehr (I don't know much about the details of it) so German traditions seems to have been prevalent at the time (so the European capital of the Hegemony and probably of the Alliance previously may have had more influence. The US seems to have been hesitant about the Alliance to begin with and then many of the early colonies near Terra drew a lot of colonists from North America, so North American influence seems to have been a fading factor).

During the First Succession War the strategic model split between the massive invasions to take terrain into raids (with warships and full regiments to begin with) to cause damage to enemy states' infrastructure, something that spread devestation far beyond the obvious warzones.  As economies and military reserves withered away the balance of expertise shifted from the 'hard' combat of invasion and direct confrontation to 'soft' combat of raid and counter-raid. While the former never vanished, during most of the Third Succession War even an entire Successor State could often only manage one such campaign every year or two due to expense and the casualties of even a successful campaign.

As a result (something that came up in the SB thread Janos Marik's boots) junior officer's main experience is of raiding, which dropped off to company or even lance sized operations. And since that's what they spent ten or twenty years doing by the time they're commanding regiments or more senior positions that's what they expect and the model of invasion and large unit operations was seriously weakened. It's not coincidental that until the late 29th century the AFFS' RCT was a purely administrative structure with regiments spread across several regiments. It was only after Melissa Davion made the RCT a combat formation that doctrine for operations above the regimental level began to recover and the AFFS adoption of this fuelled their rise to the premiere military of the Inner Sphere with their main gains at the expense of the Capellans and their pushing the DCMS back to and across the 28th century border took place after this. (Combined arms is secondary to that).

Something that MageOhki mentioned to me is that the DCMS actually has a very US model of personnel management. Unlike many militaries, they tend to move personnel between regiments quite freely, which prevents regimental identities from becoming too strong. So someone might start off their career in a Sun Zhang Cadre (not so different from the AFFS Academy cadres, admittedly) but then serve a year in the Pesht Regulars to build up experience before transferring to more active regiments along the borders in the Inner Sphere. Promotion or injury can easily move you to another regiment or into staffwork before going back to combat service with yet another regiment. In contrast, in most militaries the strength of regimental identity is such that NCOs and junior officers are very likely to be promoted only to fill open positions within the regiment. Looking at the career histories of the leaders of the AFFS from FM: FedSuns, all three of the combat officers only left their initial regiments to take up battalion command or more senior positions.

Just to throw out an idea that isn't based on canon but makes sense to me, I could see the feudal model - at least for militia or perhaps for the provincial forces of a FWL province, leading to a 'lance' of one or two 'Mechs from a noble family and a few tanks and infantry with the personnel coming from family estates. Then lances are grouped into companies based on family alliances or neighbours and so on. So combined arms as a result of feudalism.
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Minerva12345

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Re: Inner Sphere Armed Forces Handbook
« Reply #7 on: December 15, 2012, 07:42:47 AM »

Throwing out some more ideas.

The SLDF staff structure (according to one little sidebar on pg.12 of FM: SLDF) was based on the German model (Ia, Ib, Ic, IIa, etc.) rather than the US model (CoS, S-1, S-2, S-3, etc) which I think is derived from the French model (but I could be wrong) and between the War of Davion Succession and the First Succession War the Federated Suns set up a militia system based on the Prussian Landwehr (I don't know much about the details of it) so German traditions seems to have been prevalent at the time (so the European capital of the Hegemony and probably of the Alliance previously may have had more influence. The US seems to have been hesitant about the Alliance to begin with and then many of the early colonies near Terra drew a lot of colonists from North America, so North American influence seems to have been a fading factor).

I read the description. It is close to WW2 (and Kaiserheer of WW1) era Heer staff system as it was at division level. The logic is that staff has following departments: I that handles fighting related issues (essentially S-2 and S-3) and II that handles the rear related issues (S-1 and S-4). There should also be III that is military legal/court system. Outside these division had bunch of specialist officers (like Air Defense, Engineers, Technical Issues, Transportation etc). Unfortunately none of those has been described (but probably should be). This is very commander driven system.

However, the most alarming issue in description is that SLDF had no permanent staff structure below regimental level and that they use dual-hatting to deal with that problem! This means that any and all SLDF units below regiment really cannot fight independently from higher level units and that they must rely extensively on drills and SOPs. This is something Wehrmacht never was.

Summa summarum, I detest idea of Wehrmacht being used as a model because there is no army in modern times using Wehrmacht as its model. Pretty much every NATO army uses US system now (and thus the Western Alliance would use US system as well). Thus coming up to it for pure fun seems to be a peculiar choice. Is there any good in-game reason they came up to it or was it just hack writing as usual (i.e. trying to project SLDF as some kind of proud soldier race)?

On second thought I started to ponder why to choose Wehrmacht as model for SLDF. I cannot see Star League promoting race war and militarism as reasons so I think that they wanted to make it all look ideal proud soldier race guys rather than harsh reality. This is by no means impossible, for example Roman army and its genocides are typically forgotten in promotion of its legions and martial image right now in popular fiction.

Next step is to look at things a bit further. Ultimately the function does follow form so it is also interesting to see where it takes us. Wehrmacht staff system is very commander driven and fairly similar to staff system used by British Army and Soviet Army quite recently.

Following staff systems are in use:
1) Specialist officers - this was used by almost all Bronze age militaries. You'd have a bunch of specialists who gave input when asked by commander.

Game effects:
Command roll: Leader with staff bonus
Staff work bonus: 1
Time delay: 1 for cycle

2) Fixed Staff - this was used by Rome and then Napoleon in Europe. Here the army recognizes need to have fixed positions where men were posted to aid commander. Officers are specialists in their own fields.

Game effects:
Command roll: Leader with staff bonus
Staff work bonus: 2
Time delay: 1 for cycle

3) General Staff - Thus is the Continental staff system universally used by all modern military systems. This originates from Prussian military. The idea is that there are fixed staff positions/sections that plan army functions and report commander whether commander wants help or not. Subsequently you have now special planing officers who specialize in planning (called General Staff Officers). The General Staff system can be organized in multiple ways but you have two general ways to look at it.

3.a) The US/NATO system assumes that all staff sections
are at least in theory equal and can give input to commander in staff conferences. The good part is that staff churns out fearsome amount of good planning but the bad part is that commander is often consumed by staff and driven by staff initiative (rather than other way around).

Game effects:
Command roll: Staff with leader bonus
Staff work bonus: 4
Time delay:  4 for cycle

3.b) The Prussian Staff system (used by Soviet Army, Wehrmacht) practically divides staff to fighting and supporting sections. This concentrates commanding to fighting battles but hurts supporting and administrative affairs. It also takes a very brave staff officer to say against commander which can lead to problems along the line.

Game effects:
Command roll: Leader with staff bonus
Staff work bonus: 3
Time delay: 2 for cycle

The final axis is the role of commander. Some armies (US Army) make commander rely heavily on staff advice while others (Wehrmacht, Soviet Army) rely on commander making the decision.

If we assume that SLDF was born on fighting short decisive wars and its original commanders and their fighting methods were very commander driven, the staff method could easily be based on dividing the staff circus into two parts: one for fighting and one for supporting. Then you codify this in manuals after the war.

The Wehrmacht part is probably more of trying to make a break from existing US/NATO structures and thus selecting army that supports the above-mentioned staff structure and looks suitably bad ass (while propaganda and history writing taper off any unsavory details of Wehrmacht crimes and failures). Since soldiers like looking bad ass they do that as long as they are told that they are emulating "pound for pound the best army in world history" etc...
« Last Edit: December 15, 2012, 10:47:17 AM by Minerva12345 »
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drakensis

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Re: Inner Sphere Armed Forces Handbook
« Reply #8 on: December 15, 2012, 02:14:29 PM »

I've no particular expertise in soviet staff organisation (on the matter of the Heer, without wishing to defend their leaders or cause, they do appear to have punched somewhere above their weight of numbers at the time) but it would actually make sense for the Terran Alliance military to adopt methods from them. Looking at the history of Terra in JHS: Terra, while NATO won the Second Soviet Civil War, US nationalism made them quite hesitant about the Alliance. They did join but it isn't too unreasonable to think that the Western Alliance Armed Forces may have included more European and ex-Soviet troops than US troops to begin with. Therefore a more 'eastern European' organisation may have been adopted.

And the United States is explicitly not one of the states that survived McKenna's coup - it was one of those that had its government overthrown by its citizens. This strongly suggests that the US (and by extension its military), while still a wealthy and influential state, was in trouble by the end of the Alliance. Why precisely this was, is unclear.

What we know about the SLDF is that the Division was the primary strategic unit and that the regiment was the smallest unit they expected to deploy tactically. So battalions and companies might see action but only as part of action by their regiment as a rule. Thus, I suppose, the idea that below the regimental level dedicated staff officers weren't needed: any work necessary would be done by the regimental staff.

Of course, this may have been different before Kerensky - he was noted for 'streamlining' administration although that's not exactly the same thing. Then again, even with HPGs, commanders on distant stations had to be given considerable discretionary authority so a structure that enabled commanders might have made sense to the SLDF.

On this topic, would it make sense that the LCAF - drawing from the south Asian colonists of Tamar and the Scots-Irish colonists of Skye and Donegal might have adopted a more western staff pattern?
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Ice Hellion

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Re: Inner Sphere Armed Forces Handbook
« Reply #9 on: December 16, 2012, 09:32:46 AM »

The SLDF staff structure (according to one little sidebar on pg.12 of FM: SLDF) was based on the German model (Ia, Ib, Ic, IIa, etc.) rather than the US model (CoS, S-1, S-2, S-3, etc) which I think is derived from the French model (but I could be wrong)

You are right.

And to answer all the questions about the use of a German model for the SLDF, Battletech is a 1980s game and at that time, the German model seemed so powerful that it made sense to reuse it.

I like the feudal lance and the Taurian reorganisation.
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"In turn they tested each Clan namesake
in trial against the Ice Hellion's mettle.
Each chased the Ice Hellion, hunting it down.
All failed to match the predator's speed and grace.
Khan Cage smiled and said, "And that is how we shall be."

The Remembrance (Clan Ice Hellion) Passage 5, Verse 3, Lines 1 - 5

Ice Hellion

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Re: Inner Sphere Armed Forces Handbook
« Reply #10 on: December 16, 2012, 12:38:38 PM »

I like the feudal lance.

Why would the Free Worlds League be the only one to have such a specific organisation?
The Magistracy of Canopus is both close to it and eager to let people pay for military ranks.
This seems a perfect ground for a feudal lance organisation (just look at European history to understand why I said that).

While thinking about it, I found out that the Clans have the perfect organisation for it.

Here is a proposal:
The Banner is a 4 block-unit (ie a Lance for the other States).

What is a block?
1 BattleMech or a Flight (of Aerospace Fighters, VTOL, Conventional Fighters or WIGE) or an Infantry Platoon  or 1 or 2 Vehicles (I don't know yet).
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"In turn they tested each Clan namesake
in trial against the Ice Hellion's mettle.
Each chased the Ice Hellion, hunting it down.
All failed to match the predator's speed and grace.
Khan Cage smiled and said, "And that is how we shall be."

The Remembrance (Clan Ice Hellion) Passage 5, Verse 3, Lines 1 - 5

drakensis

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Re: Inner Sphere Armed Forces Handbook
« Reply #11 on: December 17, 2012, 02:16:56 AM »

Why would the Free Worlds League be the only one to have such a specific organisation?
The Magistracy of Canopus is both close to it and eager to let people pay for military ranks.
This seems a perfect ground for a feudal lance organisation (just look at European history to understand why I said that).
I was thinking of units below national level, thus militia (of any state) or FWL provinces. There's no reason another state or a mercenary unit might not use the same organisation, and I see your point about the Canopians.

So there could be a dichtomy between a Lance (a mechwarrior plus entourage) and a Platoon (a formed military unit of 3-5 units).
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Ice Hellion

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Re: Inner Sphere Armed Forces Handbook
« Reply #12 on: December 17, 2012, 01:53:50 PM »

So there could be a dichtomy between a Lance (a mechwarrior plus entourage) and a Platoon (a formed military unit of 3-5 units).

This is a good question.
I was trying to balance things in terms of power but your point is valid.
And I am still trying to figure out if I should go with 1 or 2 tanks.
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"In turn they tested each Clan namesake
in trial against the Ice Hellion's mettle.
Each chased the Ice Hellion, hunting it down.
All failed to match the predator's speed and grace.
Khan Cage smiled and said, "And that is how we shall be."

The Remembrance (Clan Ice Hellion) Passage 5, Verse 3, Lines 1 - 5

drakensis

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Re: Inner Sphere Armed Forces Handbook
« Reply #13 on: December 18, 2012, 03:44:25 AM »

So there could be a dichtomy between a Lance (a mechwarrior plus entourage) and a Platoon (a formed military unit of 3-5 units).

This is a good question.
I was trying to balance things in terms of power but your point is valid.
And I am still trying to figure out if I should go with 1 or 2 tanks.
The feudal model would probably not be standardised. It would vary depending on what the Mechwarrior's family could obtain.



On a strategic level, looking at the FWL, one point to consider is that their two borders show the advantages and disadvantages of their federal/provincial split. On the capellan front, where Andurien, Oriente and Orloff cover more than half the border with their own sizeable forces, the FWL may or may not be able to take a given world but if they do then the chances are the that the Capellans won't get it back.

On the Lyran front however there are no strong provinces along the border that can muster a strong defense if the Lyrans place pressure. As a result the border has fluctuated wildly with the Lyrans at some points succeeding in substantial advances at the expense of the League. This suggests that Provincial regiments are the key: where they're strong the League will do well, but where they are weak they will have problems. The Federal forces such as the Marik Militia don't seem to be as capable as the Oriente Hussars/Fusiliers, Defenders of Andurien, Orloff Grenadiers or even the Regulan Hussars - they're presumably hampered by divided provincial loyalties, hamstrung by political quarrels in Parliament and of course any time the Captain-General loses a majority in Parliament they can expect to take a boot to their budget-gonads.

Moving on again, the Capellan doctrine, built around relatively large numbers of jumpships, relatively compact domain and as I suggested above, few if any full regiments, they're all about hasty redeployment of their forces to address threats on different worlds. They probably have a high proportion of permanently assigned dropships and since they started building Vindicators so that they could swap them in for declining numbers of heavier 'Mechs, it seems likely that they only have a few concentrations of heavy and assault Mechs. On the other hand, their battalions have a high degree of continuity and tradition - generation after generation being sent to the same battalion (quite possibly passing down the same 'Mechs through those generations). The fact that the canonical regiments use their commander's name indicates a lot of close coherence and association with their leaders. While this may increase risks of a single battalion going rogue, it also means other battalions are unlikely to follow and 'outsider'. With this focus on relatively small operations the Capellans would do increasingly well in eras where small-unit skirmishing and raiding is the rule... and fail miserably against organised deployments of multiple regimental groups like AFFS RCTs.
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panzerfaust150

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Re: Inner Sphere Armed Forces Handbook
« Reply #14 on: December 18, 2012, 10:31:02 AM »

I do rather like the idea for the League, and it explains the League's problems. Non-standard equipment, non-standard doctrine, heck you could even say non-standard rank structures that don't have exact equivalents.

The Capellans I like, but I wonder if they would have fast reaction companies within those battalions that switch off the duty every so often. Say they spend a couple of weeks aboard an orbiting dropship waiting for a call to get sent somewhere with the rest of the battalion not far behind? I also like the small unit emphasis on the Capellans. But I would argue that the Capellan defensive doctrine is quite mature and well thought out, their offensive doctrine on the other hand....

I'm not 100% sure the US wouldn't survive the Alliance or not. Remember the throw away comment in 3075, about the US getting the best worlds close to Terra, and thus, not many of US decent surviving to 3025. Not sure I buy that, Americans are a pioneering people and there's going to be those seeking their idea of paradise as far from Terra as they can get, so I suspect just as many Americans wound up in the Periphery as well.



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