OBT Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Welcome to OurBattleTech.com - A BattleTech Fan Site

Pages: 1 2 [3]   Go Down

Author Topic: What I Don't Get About the ROTS  (Read 3521 times)

0 Members and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.

Dread Moores

  • Overste
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 740
Re: What I Don't Get About the ROTS
« Reply #30 on: June 26, 2012, 11:37:50 PM »

Funny thing I did stumble across today that I haven't seen talked about yet regarding the Republic.

At the end of Surrender Your Dreams, they flash forward to some point after the Fortress walls come down. Now I know the BT forum has talked to death about the Republic potentially taking back a bunch of their worlds (I'm not convinced of that, since the flag flown on the planet that gathering meets at is noted as a flag not seen before). What was interesting was that there was a passing reference to Damien Redburn (Exarch prior to Jonah Levin and one of the key people who managed the Fidelis operations outside the Fortress walls) not making the meeting due to a case of being all kinds of dead. Roosterboy brought this up on the BT forums and it really fascinated me.

Levin and Redburn seemed to have a friendship, though strained due to the events involving the Fidelis. Redburn later dies in "one such battle" to reclaim these lost worlds, and apparently this battle strained the friendship between him and Levin even further. This leads me to ponder that yes, maybe the Fortress does allow what some fans fear (the Republic to build up with total security), but it isn't exactly the Republic that comes out of the Fortress. At least, not Stone's Republic. Stone made a number of mistakes, but his idea was built upon this idea of assuring peace through any means necessary. I think Levin broke that dream, and that's what Redburn was pissed about. Let's say the Republic builds up forces, and comes out under a different name. Something a bit more Terran centric, as they use the resources of Terra to make this reconquest possible. Perhaps Levin even takes a few more shortcuts to assuring "the security of the Republic", like using a few more Blakist toys or war plans? Again, this leads to Redburn burning his bridges while still doing his duty.

What's that all lead to? A massive army, taking back long forgotten worlds, an army that may just be flying a new flag...maybe a Terran inspired flag? This new army uses superior force to insure its security, all while parroting themes of peace. Starting to sound familiar yet? There are some hints there, very tantalizing hints, that you could see a Terran power again. Something more Terran-centric, but something that can still fit in the reduced military size and paradigm of the post-Star League BT universe. Lacking perhaps the "I killz it wif my battleships" capability, you get a very nice blend of post-Succession Wars focus on ground combat, all while bringing back some taste of the Hegemony. A slightly militaristic faction, smack dab in the center of that map we've known for so long, with all kinds of new factions on its borders (two Clans, for example). Three spin off factions (Wolf, Falcon, and the Republic) that have all spun drastically off-course from the Star League, taking on very different views of what Terra should be in the BTU. Oh...I like the possibilities. I like the possibilities very much.
Logged
The first one to use the term Dork Age loses.

Dragon Cat

  • KU Player
  • General
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3,271
  • Not Dead Until I Say So
Re: What I Don't Get About the ROTS
« Reply #31 on: June 27, 2012, 01:26:25 AM »

IF the Fortress falls and the Republic comes out swinging then it could be very interesting - and potentially nasty but... and here's the thing

If the Fortress comes out as a "ComStar/Blakist" inspired state I think I'll go mental - they need to be very careful what's left of the Republic in Fortress Republic does not turn into more of the Blakist Protectorate than the Terran Hegemony.

I haven't read Surrender your Dreams - one of the few DA era novels I've not gotten around too - I've read it was a little rushed and tried to tie up too much in one novel - something I can kind of understand since they wanted to end the DA era completely and give CGL a completely clean slate.

I actually liked Levin, he was one of the few Paladins that had a bit of metal and wasn't to bothered with what others thought - using VSD's funeral to bring everyone together was a nice touch despite what others thought.

Redburn I didn't like at all, just didn't seem to be able to stand up for the Republic - Stone stayed in his place for three reasons

1) he won the Jihad
2) he had the forces to stand up to pretty much anything that were thrown up, he had a hardened military and war heroes from all over the Inner Sphere backing him
3) I think it was VSD who said it in Ghost War (the first DA novel) - people were afraid of him he had the look of someone who couldn't be stopped.

Damien came through as a chosen successor, didn't really have a hardened military, didn't really have many heroes people respected - most had began to see the Jihad as history as something that couldn't happen again and was consigned to the past.  When everything broke he was out of his element and not willing to take actions that needed to be taken.

If I'd have been Exarch I'd have send out ships to every single major unit in the Republic and recalled them to Prefecture X right at the start of the Jihad.  Got my barrings knew that I couldn't defend the entire Republic with what I had and stood at Prefecture X leaving the other Succession States to squabble amoungst themselves

I think that's what Stone would have done, he'd have sacrificed the Republic for Victory - Damien and the Paladins couldn't - can Levin?
Logged
My stuff, and my AU timeline follow link and enjoy

http://www.ourbattletech.com/forum/dragon-cat-collection/

The original CBT thread
Dragon Cat on CBT


Really, as long as there is an unbroken line of people calling themselves "Clan Nova Cat," it doesn't really matter to me if they're still using Iron Wombs or not. They may be dead as a faction, but as a people they still exist. It's not uncommon in the real world, after all.

JPArbiter

  • General
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1,725
  • Host of Arbitration. Your last word in Battletech
Re: What I Don't Get About the ROTS
« Reply #32 on: June 27, 2012, 10:16:42 AM »

Surrender your Dreams was not rushed in my view.  it's biggest problem was also what made it the most unique.  it did not try to tell the story in a linear way, rather it took Michael Stackpoles "Three main Characters" mechanisim, and crossed it with Quentin Tarantino's Pulp Fiction methodology.

it made it one of the most interesting reads in all of the Dark Age Storyline for me.
Logged
BattleTech products aren't Pokemon Cards. You don't have to catch, or collect them all.

WHAT NO ONE EVER TOLD ME THAT!

Knightmare

  • Terran Supremacist
  • Network Gnome
  • General
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2,459
  • Taking out the Sphere's trash since 3026
    • Our BattleTech
Re: What I Don't Get About the ROTS
« Reply #33 on: June 27, 2012, 10:35:34 AM »

I thought Damien Redburn as the second Exarch was a sound choice by Devlin Stone.

If I've read the fiction "right" Devlin Stone was concerned his cult of personality would unduly influence the future of the Republic. Devlin was a warrior, but after the Word of Blake's Jihad the Republic needed someone to lead it who wasn't. Redburn was a good choice in that regard. As an Exarch he transitioned Stone's Republic into just the Republic, was a tough cookie, had a famous last name, and wasn't from the era of "mistakes": the decades leading up to the Jihad.

Levin would be a Stone-type Exarch: A man forged into a unremitting warrior-leader during a time period of great conflict and upheaval.


Logged
Quote from: Dragon Cat
WORD (of Blake) is good for two things. 1. Leaving inappropriate notes on other people's work. 2. Adding fake words (of Blake) to the dictionary.

Dread Moores

  • Overste
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 740
Re: What I Don't Get About the ROTS
« Reply #34 on: June 27, 2012, 11:26:08 AM »

Agreed on SYD. It's the second-best DA novel to date. (Why yes, you can feel free to sue me. I LOVE BLOOD AVATAR.) I totally understand not liking the format (Pulp Fiction is an easy way to divide a room of cinephiles, with each side cursing the other as heretics). Rushed? Don't get that description.

Yeah, Levin is interesting, because he seemed to start off with the intention of being the peaceful diplomat that Redburn was meant to be. Throughout Fortress Republic and Scorpion Jar, you find out that Levin has some steel in that spine. I liked that SYD showed Redburn having that same steel (more so in some ways, as he was the one who knew that Levin could never be associated with what the Fidelis would do). Redburn effectively staked his reputation on the Republic's survival, because inevitably, the actions of the Fidelis will come to light. When that happens, Redburn is done. None of the Successor State personalities will give him the time of day, Ex-Exarch or not. This is what tends to happen when you are the overseer for operations that lead to the near-death of an entire planet for a few decades. Redburn knew that, and took it on anyway, so that Levin could lead the Republic out of the darkness with the public perception of clean hands. (Yet another reason I dig the Republic vibe. They are nasty, dirty little buggers who still want to appear lily-white. And it bites them in the tuckus every single time.

To later see Redburn die in a battle that led to a rift with Levin? That makes me very curious on what the rift was over. And whether or not it was due to Redburn believing Levin went too far. Levin didn't have his hand on what Redburn did leading up to (and during the Fortress era). He didn't see what Redburn saw as a consequence of the Fortress plan. Perhaps Redburn swung back around to believing that they couldn't do anything like that again. Levin comes out of the Fortress believing he'll do anything to insure the safety of the Republic. Sounds like some ready-made drama to me.
Logged
The first one to use the term Dork Age loses.

JPArbiter

  • General
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1,725
  • Host of Arbitration. Your last word in Battletech
Re: What I Don't Get About the ROTS
« Reply #35 on: July 10, 2012, 03:36:00 PM »

here is the other thing about the Republic that makes me say "what is there not to understand?"

the bulk of the ROTS made up of worlds of the Terran Hegemony origin, not Houses.  draw a border overlay of the ROTS over the inner sphere map in Historical Liberation of Terra 1 you will see wholly hegemony worlds make up at least half of the physical space, and the rest are saturated by jointly owned worlds with their neighbors.  historically these are the planets that for 300 years have been fought over by the houses.

the severing of the federated commonwealth was arguably the best thing that happened to this core region.  a decade of self sufficiency, followed by a decade of prosperity under the Words Aegis.  these were planets that were not thrilled with being fodder for the houses to squabble over. 

New guy shows up says "I can give your worlds the same prosperity and freedom FROM the houses as you enjoyed not so long ago, and without the technomancy of the word"  you bet your bottom dollar the chaos march/word of blake protectorate worlds will sign up given they do not owe fealty to anyone.

at that point, a house lord justifying "hmmmm let THIER economy work to rebuild shattered worlds or mine" becomes simple calculous.   

for Steiner it was "oh those damned Scots of skye?  twist my arm please!  NO YOU DO NOT GET HESPERUS OR SOLARIS!"

 For Kurita it was "those planets barely have a population left for me to rule!  hang on while I disassemble these factories you want so badly... SUCKERS"

for Davion  "What, you ONLY want that handful of planets?  and you want to keep the Cappies at bay?  sign my happy ass up"

only Liao and a chunk of Marik needed to be taken by force.
Logged
BattleTech products aren't Pokemon Cards. You don't have to catch, or collect them all.

WHAT NO ONE EVER TOLD ME THAT!

Pages: 1 2 [3]   Go Up