Topic: ComStar Advanced Concepts #001: Best Large Pulse Laser Platform (Read 7651 times)

Takiro · « **on:** October 19, 2019, 08:42:51 PM »

Well folks Iâ€™ve been thinking this week and perhaps going totally off script would be the best way to address new ComGuard equipment at this time. Rather than simply reviving Star League Royal designs which is quite possible or optimizing TRO2750 schematics for optimal gain versus the Clans we could start anew. The following testbed contest will evaluate the usefulness of further endeavors as well as shape them.

Letâ€™s begin with the InnerSphere Large Pulse Laser first introduced in the year 2609 by the Terran Hegemony during the Star League era. It hits harder than the standard Large Laser or its Extended Range brethren (+1 damage) and has only mid-range heat elevation (+2 from standard but less than +4 for ER). Most beneficial is the increased accuracy (-2 to hit) of the Pulse Lasers which is a great boon to any ComGuard. While an intriguing weapon system the InnerSphere Large Pulse Laser is somewhat limited by their relative short range (10 hexes). With an effective reach of three hundred meters or just slightly longer (a single hex) than a Medium Laser or SRMs you really canâ€™t square off at long range especially with the Clans.

So, my question to you is how best to deploy this weapon system especially against the Clans? Is the BattleMech the ideal or best platform for the Large Pulse? Should it be used in combination with another weapon to create an overwhelming advantage? Is there a specific role that a Large Pulse armed platform could best fill like anti-aircraft, conventional force killer, or Elemental neutralizer? How can we overcome its lack of range and inflict as much damage either alone or in a concerted effort as possible? Please donâ€™t narrow your scope of vison as all suggests could lead to valuable insight.

As I still love fluff and this is a ComStar driven effort I will try to give you some insight into this version of the Reformed Order in the Salient Horizon setting. We are just following Tukayyid with this endeavor to rebuild the ComGuard or perhaps assist the Word of Blake. The death of the Master has hit the would-be Jihadists hard this time around driving them to extremes. It is a harsh existence for those terrorists who seek to undermine the Brotherhood here and to make matters worse reconciliation with some Orthodox sects is appearing to take hold. Mori and Focht have corrupted these misguided Blakist back into the fold. Efforts to install Isis are in the fractured Free Worlds League have proven difficult but our Marik and Capellan allies are resolute to the cause.

While able to avoid direct participation so far, the ComGuards must still rebuild from Tukayyid and are restoring old factories on Terra as well as starting some new. Building our success against the Clans as well as our heritage as rightful successors to the SLDF recruiting is up and even some one-time dissenters have come back to the fold. Federated Commonwealth, Draconis Combine, and some other minor supporters remain ever vigilant against a renewed Clan offensive. Hopefully we may even seize the initiative against the Clans in spite of the disruption caused by the so-called Wrath of Blake. Their abortive Mars Rebellion and the Marik Civil War continues to show what a danger these fanatics can truly be.

Optimizers Prime is a new Terran based manufacture I had in mind for this but you can go with any established corporation. The only rule this time around folks is your entries must feature the InnerSphere Large Pulse Laser and of course no Clan tech. No time limit as of now but I will announce the end for entries at least a week ahead of time. Good luck and keep those ideas flowing!

Takiro · « **Reply #1 on:** October 19, 2019, 08:45:52 PM »

So, here is my initial entry dubbed the Pulsator. The idea is to take a fast Light Mech which can close distance rapidly as the ideal platform for two of these lager rapid-cycling laser systems. Better speed can boost the effective reach of these weapons which can also be utilized against aircraft and conventional forces. Probably serve as a nice hit and run asset for the ComGuard as well. EndoSteel and an Extra Light (XL) Engine allows you the available mass to mount the Big Pulses and Double Heat Sinks cool everything nicely. I think I was able to calculate the internals correctly and could have mounted Ferro-Fibrous but really wasnâ€™t sure what good another ton could do. So, I went with 7.5 tons of standard armor which results in a 120 factor even though the 35-ton chassis max is 119, sadly wasted a ton of armor. If you went with 6.5 tons of ferro-fibrous that would give you a 116 armor factor which isnâ€™t too horrible either.

Type: Pulsator
Technology Base: Inner Sphere - Level 2 Tonnage: 35

Equipment                        Mass
Internal Structure:   EndoSteel         2
Engine:            210 XL          4.5
Walking MP:         6
Running MP:         9
Jumping MP:      0
Heat Sinks:         11 (22)            1
Gyro:                           3
Cockpit:                         3
Armor Factor:         119            7.5

Internal Structure   Armor Value
Head            3         9
Center Torso         11         17 / 5
R/L Torso         8         13 / 3
R/L Arm         6         12
R/L Leg         8         16

Weapons and Ammo      Location   Critical   Tonnage
Large Pulse Laser      Right Torso      2      7
Large Pulse Laser      Left Torso      2      7

lrose · « **Reply #2 on:** October 20, 2019, 09:04:46 AM »

Pulse Master

The Pulse Master was design in response to a ComGuards request for a new unit built around the Large Pulse Laser. While most manufacturers focused on a variety of Battlemech designs, Leopard Armor proposed a hovercraft design, similar in concept to the Federated Commonwealth's Savannah Master. Having access to several Star League designs, the Leopard Armor team originally proposed a design based on the Beagle Scout Tank. However it was found that to make the deign work they would need an XL engine combined with almost paper thin armor. Simulations found that almost any hit would destroy the very costly vehicle. Rather then admit defeat, the design team instead looked at a larger design upon which to base the new vehicle. They quickly settled on the Lightning Hover Strike Craft. Designed as a fast strike vehicle, the Lightning was well suited for carrying the large pulse laser into battle. Even so the design team could not avoid the temptation to make further changes to the design.

The first change was to install a 280 rated Extra Light Fusion Engine. While expensive, this new engine greatly increased the speed of the lightning, making it faster then the Beagle Scout Tank. The fixed weapon mountings of the Lightning were found to be limited as it required the tank to point a it's target to fire it's weapon. Instead a small unmanned turret was mounted on the roof the Lightning to carry the Large Pulse Laser, allowing it to fire in any direction. Lastly the armor was nearly doubled, greatly increasing protection. Given all of the changes to the Lightning the design team renamed it the Pulse Master.

Pulse Master
Internal Structure         3.5
Engine 280XL            12
   Cruise: 13
   Flank: 20
Heatsinks   10
Control Equipment         2
Lift Equipment            3.5
Power Amplifier         0
Turret               1
Armor    107            6
   Front      25
   Sides      20
   Turret   25
   Aft      17

Weapons & Ammo
Large Pulse Laser   Turret   2   7

Takiro · « **Reply #3 on:** October 20, 2019, 06:08:32 PM »

An interesting choice Irose. Not sure I would have gone with a hovercraft but they are super fast which buys into my premise for such a Large Pulse platform. What role do you think your Pulse Master would excel at?

lrose · « **Reply #4 on:** October 20, 2019, 08:22:47 PM »

Quote from: Takiro on October 20, 2019, 06:08:32 PM

An interesting choice Irose. Not sure I would have gone with a hovercraft but they are super fast which buys into my premise for such a Large Pulse platform. What role do you think your Pulse Master would excel at?

The fluff says it all- it's a Savannah Master on steroids. The Lightning's entry in 2750 pretty much sums it up - it has a "limited but important combat role" to "close at high speed, maneuver to a position of advantage and fire its small but accurate array of short range weaponry"

You use to harass larger, slower units, break up enemy formations at the start of a battle, hit & run strikes. The basic idea is get in fast, take few shots (the reason for the turret is so you can hit then while approaching and leaving) and get the hell out of there. Then set up for another pass.

Takiro · « **Reply #5 on:** October 21, 2019, 12:04:59 AM »

It is a shame that vehicle construction rules limit the amount of energy weapons so effectively. Otherwise I'd say why not go for more on a heavier hovercraft but you'd need 17 tons (Large Pulse and 10 Heat Sinks) to mount one more.

Suppose it would be a good harasser- still I have reservations about using a XL Engine here.

lrose · « **Reply #6 on:** October 21, 2019, 06:10:00 AM »

You could use a standard Lightning which has a 210 Fusion engine - speed 11/17. Remove the weapons- add a Large Pulse Laser a turret and 1 ton of armor (total 4.5 tons FF). Personally I went for more speed. I figured this is like a light mech with an XL engine- if you are hit you are dead anyway so you might as well use the XL engine and get better performance which may help keep you from getting hit.

Takiro · « **Reply #7 on:** October 21, 2019, 06:19:04 AM »

I think you'd want some kind of survivability - granted vehicles are inherently weaker. Still the value of a ultra fast hovercraft armed with a single Large Pulse is good for sure.

Are there any other approaches out there?

What of my original Light Mech? Any comments there?

lrose · « **Reply #8 on:** October 21, 2019, 06:32:28 AM »

Quote from: Takiro on October 21, 2019, 06:19:04 AM

I think you'd want some kind of survivability - granted vehicles are inherently weaker.

But here is one area where vehicles have an advantage over battlemechs- XL engines don't make them any more vulnerable- they just add cost. If you are willing to pay the cbills then there is no reason not to use and XL engine on a vehicle and get the higher speed which offers some protection (higher to hit number, ability to move out of range of the enemy).

Your light mech is interesting but doesn't feel fast enough/maneuverable enough on the modern battlefield where medium mechs have the movement profile of a light mech and heavy mechs move 5/8 thanks to XL engines. I'd consider droping 1 of the laser for a bigger engine or jump jets or both.

Abele · « **Reply #9 on:** October 21, 2019, 12:12:40 PM »

Here's a 14/21 VTOL with an ECM suite added for extra sneakiness

Code: [Select]

Nightshade Scout VTOL [LPL

Mass: 25 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Motive Type: VTOL
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: E/X-X-E-A
Production Year: 0
Cost: 3,730,833 C-Bills
Battle Value: 656

Power Plant: Vlar 210 Fusion XL Engine
Cruise Speed: 151.2 km/h
Flanking Speed: 226.8 km/h
Armor: FiberTech Light Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
    1  Large Pulse Laser
    1  Guardian ECM Suite
Manufacturer: Yelm Weapons
    Primary Factory: New Earth (destroyed c2800)
Communications System: Johnston VRR 2.0
Targeting and Tracking System: NIRAD 210

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass  
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                      15 points                2.50
Engine:             XL Fusion Engine             210                       7.00
    Cruise MP:  14
    Flank MP:   21
Heat Sinks:         Single Heat Sink             10                        0.00
Control Equipment:                                                         1.50
Lift Equipment:                                                            2.50
Armor:              Ferro-Fibrous                AV -  53                  3.00

                                                      Armor      
                                                      Factor     
                                               Front     18        
                                          Left/Right   12/12        
                                                Rear     9         
                                               Rotor     2         

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat     Spaces     Mass  
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Large Pulse Laser                            FR        10        1         7.00
Guardian ECM Suite                           FR        0         1         1.50

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      2    Points: 7
14v        1       1       0       0      1     0   Structure:  2
Special Abilities: ECM, ENE

Takiro · « **Reply #10 on:** October 21, 2019, 04:14:24 PM »

Quote from: lrose on October 21, 2019, 06:32:28 AM

But here is one area where vehicles have an advantage over battlemechs- XL engines don't make them any more vulnerable- they just add cost. If you are willing to pay the cbills then there is no reason not to use and XL engine on a vehicle and get the higher speed which offers some protection (higher to hit number, ability to move out of range of the enemy).

You are right in saying that XL Engine Vehicles are not any different from other Vehicles in regards to vulnerability. My only concern is the canon introduction of XL Engine Vehicles didn't happen till later on but ComStar could overcome that. They not only have the need post Tukayyid but the know how and the ComGuard uses Vehicles.

Quote from: lrose on October 21, 2019, 06:32:28 AM

Your light mech is interesting but doesn't feel fast enough/maneuverable enough on the modern battlefield where medium mechs have the movement profile of a light mech and heavy mechs move 5/8 thanks to XL engines. I'd consider droping 1 of the laser for a bigger engine or jump jets or both.

Not sure I'd go lower mass (25 ton minimum) for a single Large Pulse Laser carrier but I can try it. The original idea was to fit two thus doubling your punch to a more impressive 18.

Hmm, would you consider the opposite approach then? A medium or heavy with more Large Pulses?

Quote

Here's a 14/21 VTOL with an ECM suite added for extra sneakiness

Intriguing approach Abele. Faster than Irose's Pulse Master your Heli-Pulse would not have the same 360 degree arc and less armor.

Hmm...

lrose · « **Reply #11 on:** October 21, 2019, 04:42:45 PM »

Quote from: Takiro on October 21, 2019, 04:14:24 PM

You are right in saying that XL Engine Vehicles are not any different from other Vehicles in regards to vulnerability. My only concern is the canon introduction of XL Engine Vehicles didn't happen till later on but ComStar could overcome that. They not only have the need post Tukayyid but the know how and the ComGuard uses Vehicles.

Not true-TR3075 Royal variants of the Nightshade, Demon, Rhino and Puma all us XL engines - I see no reason why Comstar can't design one.

Quote

Hmm, would you consider the opposite approach then? A medium or heavy with more Large Pulses?

Working on something- I'll try to post it in a little bit.

Takiro · « **Reply #12 on:** October 21, 2019, 05:17:10 PM »

Ah, very good. I remember in the Shattered Dawn universe that XL Engines on Vehicles was a big stumbling block which didn't seem to change until 3058. But those canon examples which ComStar may know about could serve as a basis for the first lostech vehicle I suppose.

I look forward to any and all concepts here!!

lrose · « **Reply #13 on:** October 21, 2019, 05:38:25 PM »

The fluff is a bit rough but here you go.

Durendal

Project Durendal began as an attempt by Comstar to counter the military technology superiority of the Clans. One of the Clans greatest weaknesses is their adherence to strict combat rules, something no Inner Sphere commander would follow. Precentor Derek Halverson fought at Tukayyid and after the battle returned to Terra, where he was assigned to help develop new weapons to counter the Clans. Precentor Halverson saw the Clan's use of the Batchall as their greatest weakness. Most importantly, the defender of the Batchall gets to chose the battlefield, this allows the defender an incredible advantage. Precentor Halverson suggested developing a new mech suited for close combat. The idea was that the Comstar defenders would declare the battlefield to be a city or other area that would negate the Clans range advantage.

Built on the largest frame possible, the Durendal is a relatively slow mech. However in an urban environment this is not considered a major issue. The mech uses a standard 300 rated engine rather then the lighter XL models, it was felt that the better survivability of the standard engine was more important than the mass savings. In an effort to help with the mech's mobility, the Durendal carries jump jets capable propelling the mech 90 meters in a single leap. The Durendal use 19 tons of standard plate armor providing a strong defense against enemy fire.

The Durendal's weapon array is designed for close combat. The main guns are a trio of Large Pulse Lasers mounted in the torsos and arms. Back up these guns are a trio of Medium Pulse Lasers, one of which covers the rear arc and a single Small Pulse Laser. Lastly the Durendal carries a massive hatchet in it's right arm. In an effort to increase the potency of the Hatchet, the design team used Triple Strength Myomers. Combined with the Hatchet, they allow the Durendal to cleave almost any other mech in half. To maximize the performance of the Triple Strength Myomers requires careful control of the mech's heat curve, the coolant system has been specially designed to allow individual heatsinks to be turned on and off. It is not clear where Comstar acquired the TSM from, but rumors suggested they stole the plans from the Capellans.

Tonnage 100 tons
Internal Structure          10
Engine: 300             19
Walking MPs: 3
Running MPs: 5
Jumping MPs: 3
Heatsinks 15 (30)         5
Gyro           3
Cockpit          3
Armor 304         19
    IS Armor
Head 3 9
CT 31 47/14
RT/LT 21 32/10
RA/LA 17 34
RL/LL 21 41

Weapons & Ammo
Hatchet         RA   7   7
Small Pulse Laser   H   1   1
Large Pulse Laser    RT   2   7
Medium Pulse Laser   RT   1   2
Large Pulse Laser   LT   2   7
Medium Pulse Laser   LT   1   2
TSM            LT   6   0
Large Pulse Laser   LA   2   7
Medium Pulse Laser   CT(r)   1   2
Jump Jet         CT   1   2
Jump Jet         RL    1   2
Jump Jet         LL   1   2

Abele · « **Reply #14 on:** October 21, 2019, 06:39:19 PM »

Here's a modded Lancelot dropping the 360Xl for a 300XL for the extra weight to carry four large pulsers

Code: [Select]

Lancelot LNC25-04PL

Mass: 60 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: E/X-X-E-A
Production Year: 3062
Cost: 11,702,400 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,422

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 300 Fusion XL Engine
Walking Speed: 54.0 km/h
Maximum Speed: 86.4 km/h
Jump Jets: None
    Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Unknown Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
    4  Large Pulse Lasers
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass  
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel                    99 points                3.00
    Internal Locations: 1 HD, 1 CT, 2 LT, 2 RT, 4 LA, 4 RA
Engine:             XL Fusion Engine             300                       9.50
    Walking MP: 5
    Running MP: 8
    Jumping MP: 0 
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             14(28)                    4.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 1 LT, 1 RT
Gyro:               Standard                                               3.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA    R: SH+UA
Armor:              Ferro-Fibrous                AV - 170                  9.50
    Armor Locations: 1 CT, 2 LT, 2 RT, 2 LA, 3 RA, 2 LL, 2 RL

                                                      Internal       Armor      
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     20           24        
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  9         
                                           L/R Torso     14           18        
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  8         
                                             L/R Arm     10           16        
                                             L/R Leg     14           22        

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass  
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Large Pulse Laser                            RT        10        2         7.00
Large Pulse Laser                            LT        10        2         7.00
Large Pulse Laser                            RA        10        2         7.00
Large Pulse Laser                            LA        10        2         7.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 3

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      6    Points: 14
5          3       3       0       0      3     1   Structure:  3
Special Abilities: ENE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA

And another that retains the 360XL, but ony carries two LPLs and two MPLs

Code: [Select]

Lancelot LNC25-04Z

Mass: 60 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: E/X-X-E-A
Production Year: 3062
Cost: 13,686,400 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,388

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 360 Fusion XL Engine
Walking Speed: 64.8 km/h
Maximum Speed: 97.2 km/h
Jump Jets: None
    Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Unknown Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
    2  Large Pulse Lasers
    2  Medium Pulse Lasers
    1  Guardian ECM Suite
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass  
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel                    99 points                3.00
    Internal Locations: 1 HD, 3 LT, 3 RT, 3 LA, 2 RA, 1 LL, 1 RL
Engine:             XL Fusion Engine             360                      16.50
    Walking MP: 6
    Running MP: 9
    Jumping MP: 0 
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             14(28)                    4.00
Gyro:               Standard                                               4.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA    R: SH+UA
Armor:              Ferro-Fibrous                AV - 179                 10.00
    Armor Locations: 3 LT, 3 RT, 3 LA, 3 RA, 1 LL, 1 RL

                                                      Internal       Armor      
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     20           23        
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  15        
                                           L/R Torso     14           18        
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  10        
                                             L/R Arm     10           16        
                                             L/R Leg     14           22        

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass  
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Guardian ECM Suite                           CT        0         2         1.50
Medium Pulse Laser                           RT        4         1         2.00
Medium Pulse Laser                           LT        4         1         2.00
Large Pulse Laser                            RA        10        2         7.00
Large Pulse Laser                            LA        10        2         7.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 9

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      6    Points: 14
6          4       4       0       0      3     0   Structure:  3
Special Abilities: ECM, ENE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA

OBT Forum

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Author Topic: ComStar Advanced Concepts #001: Best Large Pulse Laser Platform (Read 7651 times)

Takiro

ComStar Advanced Concepts #001: Best Large Pulse Laser Platform

Takiro

Re: ComStar Advanced Concepts #001: Best Large Pulse Laser Platform

lrose

Re: ComStar Advanced Concepts #001: Best Large Pulse Laser Platform

Takiro

Re: ComStar Advanced Concepts #001: Best Large Pulse Laser Platform

lrose

Re: ComStar Advanced Concepts #001: Best Large Pulse Laser Platform

Takiro

Re: ComStar Advanced Concepts #001: Best Large Pulse Laser Platform

lrose

Re: ComStar Advanced Concepts #001: Best Large Pulse Laser Platform

Takiro

Re: ComStar Advanced Concepts #001: Best Large Pulse Laser Platform

lrose

Re: ComStar Advanced Concepts #001: Best Large Pulse Laser Platform

Abele

Re: ComStar Advanced Concepts #001: Best Large Pulse Laser Platform

Takiro

Re: ComStar Advanced Concepts #001: Best Large Pulse Laser Platform

lrose

Re: ComStar Advanced Concepts #001: Best Large Pulse Laser Platform

Takiro

Re: ComStar Advanced Concepts #001: Best Large Pulse Laser Platform

lrose

Re: ComStar Advanced Concepts #001: Best Large Pulse Laser Platform

Abele

Re: ComStar Advanced Concepts #001: Best Large Pulse Laser Platform