Topic: MA's Vision of Clan OmniMechs: 3048 and Beyond (Read 1394 times)

masterarminas · « **on:** March 08, 2018, 01:45:21 AM »

A lot of you have been wondering (and asking) where I am going with these Configuration Challenges. Well. I'm here to tell you that.

It all started with my work on Handbook: Goliath Scorpion (which is about 2/3rds complete, by the way!) and the Scorpion Series OmniMechs (and OmniFighters) for that AU.

I knew all along that the other Clans wouldn't just stand by and let the Scorpions (of all factions!) upset the apple cart of the status quo. So. If the Scorpions began to design and produce new OmniMechs, it would change the balance of power. To compensate, I considered this idea: what if the Scorpion Revival (heh!) began in response to the Dragoon Compromise?

"Let us seek to upgrade our Toumans with new designs, new thoughts, so that when this Reconnaissance Mission is complete and the Crusade to reclaim the Inner Sphere begins, we shall be prepared with our fiercest technological wonders!"

Or something like that. Which spurs other Clans to do just that. In Canon, we know the Shadow Cat debuted in 3003, the Adder and Dire Wolf in 3010. What if everyone began to examine their forces and build in preparation for the Invasion?

Anyway, that was my thought. And these Configuration Challenges are addressing that. And here is what I am picturing:

The following OmniMechs will be in production by no later than 3048. Clans producing those OmniMechs will be listed behind them in parentheses. Others will be added later.

What I want from you guys is to examine this list. See if it makes any sense. Suggest changing the Clans making some of these machines. Maybe adding a few more (Grendel/Mongrel?? Nova Cat?? Hmm??). Remember, the list is not yet complete. We will be adding more fixed JJ OmniMechs and a couple of more standard (not XL) engine OmniMechs, plus there WILL be a Hellbringer II, a Summoner II, a Gargoyle successor, and an Executioner successor. And I may let the Jaguars and/or Bears do a Mad Dog II design.

Who knows? I don't. Not right now. But with your help and input. I will.

And here is the list so far.

30 tons
Arctic Cheetah (Smoke Jaguar)
Arctic Fox (Diamond Shark, Ghost Bear, Ice Hellion, Snow Raven, Star Adder)
Hellion (Burrock, Hell's Horses, Ice Hellion, Nova Cat)
35 tons
Adder (Star Adder; Wolf)
Boreal Wildcat (Ice Hellion, Jade Falcon)
40 tons
Battle Cobra (Blood Spirit, Steel Viper)
Thunder Hound (Ice Hellion)
Viper (Coyote, Fire Mandrill, Ghost Bear)
45 tons
Hooded Eagle (Diamond Shark, Goliath Scorpion, Star Adder, Wolf)
Shadow Cat (Cloud Cobra, Nova Cat)
50 tons
Huntsman (Nova Cat)
Sable Raptor (Ice Hellion)
Sand Devil (Goliath Scorpion)
55 tons
Stooping Hawk (Blood Spirit)
Stormcrow (Smoke Jaguar, Snow Raven)
60 tons
Desert Tiger (Cloud Cobra, Diamond Shark, Goliath Scorpion, Snow Raven, Wolf)
Mad Dog II (Diamond Shark, Ghost Bear, Smoke Jaguar)
65 tons
Crossbow (Blood Spirit, Steel Viper)
Hellbringer II (Hell's Horses, Jade Falcons)
70 tons
Goliath Scorpion (Coyote, Goliath Scorpion, Jade Falcon, Star Adder)
Unnamed OmniMech (Ice Hellion)
75 tons
Timber Wolf (Wolf)
Unnamed OmniMech (Blood Spirit, Steel Viper)
80 tons
Gargoyle II (Wolf)
85 tons
Unnamed OmniMech (Jade Falcon)
Warhawk (Smoke Jaguar)
90 tons
Dune Stalker (Burrock, Coyote, Goliath Scorpion)
Kingfisher (Blood Spirit, Ghost Bear, Steel Viper)
95 tons
Executioner II (Ghost Bear)
100 tons
Dire Wolf (Smoke Jaguar, Wolf)

Advice? Thoughts? Ideas? All are welcome.

MA

marauder648 · « **Reply #1 on:** March 08, 2018, 04:14:28 AM »

Very intersting! So more rational and sensible Clanners at least in some regards, it seems to be going along the lines of your superb Scorpio Ascendant story/TL.

drakensis · « **Reply #2 on:** March 08, 2018, 04:48:47 AM »

I'm not seeing any exclusive Nova Cat designs there and before their decision to join the 2nd Star League they were one of the largest and most powerful clans.

It's hard to know what they built since their factories would have been either disassembled or taken over by the point we start getting a look at the homeworlds but the Huntsman was certainly theirs and dates to this period. Possibly give them them an earlier Nova Cat (maybe grow it to 80 tons since there's only 1 mech on your list in that bracket) to give them a balanced spread of designs (Hellion, Shadow Cat, Huntsman, Nova Cat)?

marauder648 · « **Reply #3 on:** March 08, 2018, 05:38:55 AM »

Whilst the Cats were one of the biggest Clans, they were seemingly a non-entity in the fluff and lore until they decided to join the 2nd Star League and used the same stuff as everyone else. This is definately something that should be corrected.

masterarminas · « **Reply #4 on:** March 08, 2018, 09:41:53 AM »

Quote from: drakensis on March 08, 2018, 04:48:47 AM

I'm not seeing any exclusive Nova Cat designs there and before their decision to join the 2nd Star League they were one of the largest and most powerful clans.

It's hard to know what they built since their factories would have been either disassembled or taken over by the point we start getting a look at the homeworlds but the Huntsman was certainly theirs and dates to this period. Possibly give them them an earlier Nova Cat (maybe grow it to 80 tons since there's only 1 mech on your list in that bracket) to give them a balanced spread of designs (Hellion, Shadow Cat, Huntsman, Nova Cat)?

I can't believe I forgot the Huntsman! Added, Drakensis, and thank you! I do like the idea of an 80-ton Nova Cat, as well.

MA

marauder648 · « **Reply #5 on:** March 08, 2018, 10:51:03 AM »

A 80 ton version of the Nova Cat...where do I sign up? :p

Takiro · « **Reply #6 on:** March 08, 2018, 01:22:31 PM »

Well if I may chime in it seems like the first Scorpion design (the Hooded Eagle) is an improvement on an existing one, the Ice Ferret which was already upgraded from the Wolf Hunter. This refinement occurring in the early 3000s when the call for the Crusade is growing could be a Warden project to strengthen their forces in the face of growing antagonism especially in light of the Dragoon Compromise. Likewise the Crusaders feeling their time is at hand could look this precedent and pull their own upgrade (Summoner II which I will come back to in a moment). It could be this Warden-Crusader arms race that is the backdrop for your challenges here MA.

Now on to the Goliath Scorpion which looks to me like a Summoner II. Same weight, movement (minus jump jets which should not be fixed for true OmniMechs IMO), with EndoSteel and Ferro-Fibrous. If this were me I'd just combine the designs into one and it would make sense for Jade Falcon to do it.

Speaking of doing it, even if we don't currently have something for each Clan (not sure if that is a goal) we can see what each Clan eventually does create like the Nova Cats which can certainly give us a clue into what they do. I propose we come up with a rough design doctrine for each Clan and plot out an overall design plan. Which Clan prefers what type of Mech? Weight class? Speed? I sent MA my thoughts on a Cloud Cobra Light (new 25 tonner) and a Blood Spirit Heavy (poor man's assault) for future design possibilities.

And the 50 ton chassis is ripe for these design possibilities as no such design is currently in production.

masterarminas · « **Reply #7 on:** March 08, 2018, 10:41:45 PM »

Quote from: Takiro on March 08, 2018, 01:22:31 PM

Well if I may chime in it seems like the first Scorpion design (the Hooded Eagle) is an improvement on an existing one, the Ice Ferret which was already upgraded from the Wolf Hunter. This refinement occurring in the early 3000s when the call for the Crusade is growing could be a Warden project to strengthen their forces in the face of growing antagonism especially in light of the Dragoon Compromise. Likewise the Crusaders feeling their time is at hand could look this precedent and pull their own upgrade (Summoner II which I will come back to in a moment). It could be this Warden-Crusader arms race that is the backdrop for your challenges here MA.

Now on to the Goliath Scorpion which looks to me like a Summoner II. Same weight, movement (minus jump jets which should not be fixed for true OmniMechs IMO), with EndoSteel and Ferro-Fibrous. If this were me I'd just combine the designs into one and it would make sense for Jade Falcon to do it.

Speaking of doing it, even if we don't currently have something for each Clan (not sure if that is a goal) we can see what each Clan eventually does create like the Nova Cats which can certainly give us a clue into what they do. I propose we come up with a rough design doctrine for each Clan and plot out an overall design plan. Which Clan prefers what type of Mech? Weight class? Speed? I sent MA my thoughts on a Cloud Cobra Light (new 25 tonner) and a Blood Spirit Heavy (poor man's assault) for future design possibilities.

And the 50 ton chassis is ripe for these design possibilities as no such design is currently in production.

I'll give it some thought, Takiro. I don't want too many designs . . . but we definitely need a few to fill specific niches. And, you are correct. If the Falcons can get over it being a Warden design, the Goliath Scorpion could fill the bill nicely as the de facto version of the Summoner II. Just like in this AU, Clan Wolf will not be manufacturing the Linebacker since the Desert Tiger already fills that role (at 5 tons lighter with more armor and pod-space to boot!).

MA

Ice Hellion · « **Reply #8 on:** March 09, 2018, 04:22:43 AM »

Quote from: masterarminas on March 08, 2018, 10:41:45 PM

Just like in this AU, Clan Wolf will not be manufacturing the Linebacker since the Desert Tiger already fills that role (at 5 tons lighter with more armor and pod-space to boot!).

MA

Oh no

here goes my fluff down.

Ice Hellion · « **Reply #9 on:** March 09, 2018, 04:24:54 AM »

Why not go further in the collective approach and make the factories a collective good, with each Clan having to raise a certain number of units depending on its population and each Clan receiving a percentage of the total production (population wise? unit wise?)?

Vition2 · « **Reply #10 on:** March 09, 2018, 04:15:00 PM »

Quote from: masterarminas on March 08, 2018, 01:45:21 AM

85 tons
Unnamed OmniMech (Jade Falcon)
Warhawk (Smoke Jaguar)
90 tons
Dune Stalker (Burrock, Coyote, Goliath Scorpion)
Kingfisher (Blood Spirit, Ghost Bear, Steel Viper)
95 tons
Executioner II (Ghost Bear)
100 tons
Dire Wolf (Smoke Jaguar, Wolf)

Advice? Thoughts? Ideas? All are welcome.

MA

I would seriously consider switching up the 85-ton Jade Falcon design with the 95-ton Turkina, I figure you're trying to keep the number of higher-weight 'Mechs lower, but if the Executioner II doesn't end up with jump jets, then the three 95- and 100-tonners would all fill different niches. The Falcons are supposed to be one of the more industrial/commercial clans so them having an upper end assault is not too far fetched, imo.

That 85-ton slot could be filled with either the Savage Coyote chassis or the Deimos chassis. I could easily see the Coyotes wanting to produce a preeminent assault machine on their own (removing them from the Dune Stalker, or not). While the Deimos could be a joint venture between the Snow Ravens and either the Nova Cats and/or Blood Spirits (I would have tossed the Ghost Bears in as an option too, but with both the Kingfisher and Executioner II, they probably have all the assaults they need), other clans are certainly options as well.

marauder648 · « **Reply #11 on:** March 10, 2018, 04:08:55 AM »

I have to agree, put the Turkey in as the 95 tonner, the Falcons are pretty much the most powerful (all round) of the Crusader faction and then you could slide an 85-ton from the Wardens in to that bracket.

The Turkina just missed out on being a major part of REVIVAL so with the Clans actually looking at their Mechs and going "dear gods who thought up these configs? Why does it have 5 tons of SRM ammo? Why's that one got three AMS!?" and so on then gaps in the Tourmans would be filled.

We know that basically unless you salvage one, or the Wolves give you one, your clan is NOT going to have any Dire Wolves. And Warhawks are even more limited as the Jags point blank refused to share this shiny toy with anyone unless it was Isorla or salvage.

This leaves pretty much everyone with the following

Kingfisher
Executioner (I think this was quite common)
Gargoyle - which is shit and needs to be redesigned from the ground up to be of any use, seriously..that Prime config, who ever thought that weapons mix was good needed to be flogged, flayed, shot then reaved just to make sure.

With the 100 tonner being largely a Jaguar only design (as the Wolves didn't really dole them out) the Executioner II could be a Warden thing designed with Bear assistance to let them have it and then a new 85 tonner gets made as a more available Warhawk answer, and another 80 tonner for the more resource poor Clans or not.

80 tons
Gargolye (Wolf/affiliated Clans)
Unnamed OmniMech
85 tons
Unnamed OmniMech (Warden design by Clan Coyote)
Warhawk (Smoke Jaguar)
90 tons
Dune Stalker (Burrock, Coyote, Goliath Scorpion)
Kingfisher (Blood Spirit, Ghost Bear, Steel Viper)
95 tons
Executioner II (Ghost Bear)
Turkina (Jade Falcon)
100 tons
Dire Wolf (Smoke Jaguar, Wolf)

Also I'd suggest killing the Naga off entirely in most Clans save the Hellions and the few other Clans who didn't totally hate artillery. Having an 80-tonner as a pure artillery platform makes no sense in the Clans.

wolfcannon · « **Reply #12 on:** March 10, 2018, 11:01:08 AM »

Naga is mainly a Clan Wolf 2nd Line mech.

masterarminas · « **Reply #13 on:** March 10, 2018, 01:08:57 PM »

Okay. Here is the second look at the OmniMechs I am planning for this little project. A total of 35 OmniMechs (with room for maybe (maybe) one or two more, if ya'll think a specific niche needs to be filled. Units followed by an asterisk (*) use a standard engine.

30 tons
Arctic Cheetah [7/11/7; AV 96; Active Probe; 8.5 tons pod-space]
Arctic Fox [10/15/0 (20); AV 105; 6.5 tons pod-space]
Hellion [9/14/0 (18); AV 105; 8.5 tons pod-space]

35 tons
Adder [6/9/0; AV 115; Flamer; 16.0 tons pod-space]
Boreal Wildcat [8/12/0 (16); AV 115; 12.0 tons pod-space]
Unnamed [7/11/0; AV 96; 10.0 tons pod-space]*

40 tons
Battle Cobra [6/9/0; AV 124; 14.0 tons pod-space]*
Thunder Hound [7/11/0 (14); AV 134; 15.0 tons pod-space]
Viper [8/12/8; AV 134; 8.5 tons pod-space]

45 tons
Hooded Eagle [8/12/0; AV 153; 11.0 tons pod-space]
Shadow Cat [6/9/6 (12); AV 134; 17.0 tons pod-space]

50 tons
Huntsman [5/8/5; AV 169; 23.5 tons pod-space]
Sable Raptor [6/9/0 (12); AV 163; 21.5 tons pod-space]
Sand Devil [7/11/0; AV 169; 16.5 tons pod-space]

55 tons
Stooping Hawk [5/8/5; AV 172; 21.5 tons pod-space]*
Stormcrow [6/9/0; AV 182; 23.0 tons pod-space]

60 tons
Desert Tiger [6/9/0; AV 201; 23.0 tons pod-space]
Mad Dog II [5/8/0; AV 201; 29.0 tons pod-space; 12 fixed DHS]

65 tons
Crossbow [5/8/0; AV 192; 16.0 tons pod-space]*
Hellbringer II [5/8/0; AV 211; 28.5 tons pod-space; 13 fixed DHS]

70 tons
Goliath Scorpion [5/8/0; AV 211; 29.5 tons pod-space; 14 fixed DHS]
Grizzly II [4/6/4; AV 216; 34.0 tons pod-space; 11 fixed DHS]
Snow Leopard [5/8/0 (10); AV 211; 28.5 tons pod-space; 12 fixed DHS]

75 tons
Timber Wolf [5/8/0; AV 230; 27.5 tons pod-space; 15 fixed DHS]
Stone Lion [4/6/0; AV 230; 32.0 tons pod-space; 12 fixed DHS]*

80 tons
Gargoyle [5/8/0; AV 247; 27.5 tons pod-space; 12 fixed DHS]
Nova Cat [4/6/0; AV 240; 32.0 tons pod-space; 12 fixed DHS]

85 tons
Savage Coyote [4/6/0; AV 259; 43.5 tons pod-space; 13 fixed DHS]
Warhawk [4/6/0; AV 259; 32.5 tons pod-space; 20 fixed DHS]

90 tons
Dune Stalker [4/6/0; AV 278; 39.0 tons pod-space; 14 fixed DHS]
Kingfisher [4/6/0; AV 278; 24.0 tons pod-space; 17 fixed DHS]*

95 tons
Executioner II [4/6/4; AV 288; 37.5 tons pod-space; 12 fixed DHS]
Turkina [3/5/3; AV 288; 42.0 tons pod-space; 15 fixed DHS]

100 tons
Blood Spirit [3/5/0; AV 307; 52.0 tons pod-space; 12 fixed DHS]*
Dire Wolf [3/5/0; AV 304; 50.5 tons pod-space; 15 fixed DHS]

We can talk about what Clans will develop and/or produce them, as well as use them. Let me know your thoughts.

MA

masterarminas · « **Reply #14 on:** March 10, 2018, 10:56:38 PM »

Note that while these will be the only OmniMech designs in production, older units will continue to see use (albeit, for the most part, anyway, in second-line units). At least until they are phased out by the lack of new parts (although, the Nova production ended in canon in 2921 and it remained in front-line use up to and past Operation Revival!).

Thus, you will continue to see the Fire Moth, Mist Lynx, Kit Fox, Ice Ferret, Mad Dog, Hellbringer, Summoner, Gargoyle, Naga, and Executioner in limited numbers within the Clan Toumans (diminishing over time, however). Heck, you might even see a few rare examples of the Coyotl, Lupus, and Woodsman in some units!

Just some thoughts.

MA

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Author Topic: MA's Vision of Clan OmniMechs: 3048 and Beyond (Read 1394 times)

masterarminas

MA's Vision of Clan OmniMechs: 3048 and Beyond

marauder648

Re: MA's Vision of Clan OmniMechs: 3048 and Beyond

drakensis

Re: MA's Vision of Clan OmniMechs: 3048 and Beyond

marauder648

Re: MA's Vision of Clan OmniMechs: 3048 and Beyond

masterarminas

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marauder648

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Takiro

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masterarminas

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Ice Hellion

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Ice Hellion

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Vition2

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marauder648

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wolfcannon

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masterarminas

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masterarminas

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