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Author Topic: Optimizing the Ostscout  (Read 9746 times)

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Bradshaw

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Re: Optimizing the Ostscout
« Reply #30 on: January 22, 2020, 09:59:49 AM »

I'll leave this but realize you meant years afterwards. No it doesn't mention years for it



pg 102
Communications Equipment: Communications equipment (see p. 212, TechManual) can be used to generate an ECCM field with the same area of effect as an Inner Sphere Guardian ECM Suite. Any unit that mounts 3 to 6 tons of communications equipment equals half of an ECM suite when generating an ECCM field. If the unit mounts 7 or more tons of communications equipment, it equals 1 ECM suite when generating an ECCM. Any time communications equipment is used to generate an ECCM field, all other bonus modifiers are lost.

pg 104
Equipment: Communications equipment (see p. 212, TechManual) can be used to generate ghost targets with the same area of effect as an Inner Sphere Guardian ECM suite. However, to do so, the unit must mount 7 or more tons of communications equipment. Any time communications equipment is used to generate an ECCM field, all other bonus modifiers are lost.

Ghost Targets
An ECM suite can be tuned to generate “ghost targets” that may affect the ability of enemy units to properly target friendly units. The ECM loses its normal functions when used in this way. The player must announce the switch to ghost target generation in the End Phase of any turn, or may set the suite for ghost target generation at the start of the scenario. In either case, note the change on the record sheet of the unit in question. At the start of every Weapon Attack Phase when an ECM is tuned to generating ghost targets, the controlling player makes a Piloting Skill Roll with a +2 modifier; no other modifiers are applied to this roll. If the roll fails, he did not tune the ECM correctly and no effects are applied for that turn. On a successful roll result, he attuned the ECM properly; the player should note the result’s Margin of Success.

During a turn’s Weapon Attack Phase, if a weapon attack passes through the ECM bubble of an enemy ECM tuned to generating ghost targets and the controlling player made a successful Piloting Skill Roll that turn, the attacking player must also make a Piloting Skill Roll before making a to-hit roll for the weapon attack in question; the only modifier added to this Piloting Skill Roll is the MoS of the enemy ECM unit. If the roll is a success, the to-hit roll is made as normal; the attacker’s targeting and tracking system is able to differentiate between all the ghost targets. If the roll fails, for every 2 MoF (round down), apply a +1 to-hit modifier to all weapon attacks that pass through the ECM bubble for that turn by that  attacker.

Note that an attacking player only makes a single roll, regardless of how many weapons are firing, applying any modifiers to all weapon attacks equally.

If an attack passes through multiple ghost target-generating ECM fields, only a single roll is made. Determine the highest Margin of Success from those multiple enemy ECM fields, applying an additional +1 for each additional field, and then applying the total modifier to the Piloting Skill Roll. A +4 to-hit modifier is the maximum that can be applied to a weapon attack through the use of ghost target ECM fields. For example, if an attack passed through three ghost target-generating ECM fields and the highest Margin of Success of those fields was a 3, the modifier applied to the Piloting Skill Roll would be 4 [+3 (highest MoS of the three ECM fields) +2 (2 additional ECM fields) = 5, but only a maximum +4 can be applied].

pg 196
Cockpit Command Console: A BattleMech mounting a cockpit command console (see p. 300) may determine if a Satellite is available or attempt to establish a Satellite uplink with a friendly or neutral Satellite, but can do so and still move and fire normally in the subsequent turn, provided the second warrior does not need to take any actions to do so. For the turn following the turn in which the player announced that the BattleMech will determine if a Satellite is available, or establish a connection to a friendly or neutral Satellite, the +2 Initiative for the cockpit command console is lost. A cockpit command console cannot be used to hack into a hostile Satellite.

pg 226
Communications Equipment: If a unit on a side mounts 3 to 6 tons of communications equipment (see p. 212, TM) or a cockpit command console (see p. 360), once the player has rolled the dice to use a sensor, the player then rolls 1D6. On a result of 1–3, the numerical value below the original dice roll result is added to it; on a result of 4–6, the numerical value above the original dice roll result is added. For example, a player with a Beagle Active Probe rolls 2D6 for sensor detection and gets a result of 6, meaning he detects any enemy units in medium range. Because his side has communications equipment, he immediately rolls 1D6 and gets a result of 3. This means that that a 5 is added to the original 6 (5 is one numerical value less than 6). Such a result doesn’t change anything in this example; however, if the player had rolled a 4, then 7 would have been added to the 6, meaning the player would detect any units in the medium and short range brackets.

If a unit on a side mounts 7 or more tons of communications equipment, once the player has rolled the dice to use a sensor, the numerical values above and below the original dice roll result are also added. For example, on a result of 5, the values of 4 and 6 are added.

These benefits apply to all units on a side, but the units mounting the equipment must be on the playing area; if they leave the playing area for any reason (to retreat, due to off-map movement (see p. 192) and so on), these benefits are lost. Additionally, if the communications equipment or cockpit command console loses its Initiative bonuses for any reason (see Communications Equipment and Cockpit Command Console, p. 212, TM, and 300, respectively), the benefits of these items for double-blind play are lost as well (if the Initiative bonuses are recovered, these benefits also resume). Only a single communications equipment or cockpit command console bonus can be applied in this fashion.

Note that the 67-hex range for monitoring a remote sensor is not changed, regardless of the communications equipment available to a side (see below).

Remote Sensors: As noted in the Remote Sensor rules (see p. 375), if a unit mounts any of the following equipment and is within 67 hexes of a friendly remote sensor, it can monitor that friendly remote sensor: active probe, C3 master computer, improved C3 computer, cockpit command console or communications equipment. In place of rolling for its sensors, the controlling player of the unit in question can instead roll for one remote sensor (regardless of how many it can monitor), with all the same results applied as noted above.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2020, 10:21:40 AM by Bradshaw »
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Takiro

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Re: Optimizing the Ostscout
« Reply #31 on: January 22, 2020, 06:07:47 PM »

Very nice Bradshaw!
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Ice Hellion

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Re: Optimizing the Ostscout
« Reply #32 on: January 23, 2020, 12:28:56 AM »

I'll leave this but realize you meant years afterwards. No it doesn't mention years for it

There is no year because it is just more equipment like those in the cockpit of any 'Mech, Aerospace Fighter, Tank... (as a proof, the rules state that such cockpit is seen as 1 ton of communication equipment). For me, once you can build them, you have access to communication equipment.
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"In turn they tested each Clan namesake
in trial against the Ice Hellion's mettle.
Each chased the Ice Hellion, hunting it down.
All failed to match the predator's speed and grace.
Khan Cage smiled and said, "And that is how we shall be."

The Remembrance (Clan Ice Hellion) Passage 5, Verse 3, Lines 1 - 5

Takiro

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Re: Optimizing the Ostscout
« Reply #33 on: January 23, 2020, 04:00:14 PM »

I'd tend to agree Ice and there is alot of options there too. I've got a few ideas but not a lot of experience when using this equipment during game play.

Working on finishing the Jenner review still which I know is running long gang.

Remember that this contest runs out tomorrow - so get those designs in while you can! ;)
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Takiro

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Re: Optimizing the Ostscout
« Reply #34 on: January 24, 2020, 03:52:23 PM »

Just about 8 hours remaining!
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Takiro

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Re: Optimizing the Ostscout
« Reply #35 on: January 25, 2020, 08:00:49 AM »

Well that's all folks, we are official closed for this competition although there may be another special one appearing soon. ;)
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Takiro

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Re: Optimizing the Ostscout
« Reply #36 on: February 02, 2020, 02:17:29 PM »

Working on this one already folks, hope to have it done before the end of the week!
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Takiro

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Re: Optimizing the Ostscout
« Reply #37 on: February 08, 2020, 01:43:35 PM »

Quality over quantity is something I am keen to with these challenges and despite not having all our usual participants which is a negative I am happy to say we still got nearly a dozen entries by four designers. I am very happy to say no one was disqualified for lack of fluff or illegal modifications which I don’t like to do during these contests. I put a lot of work into judging these competitions and I know you all put work into your submissions so I hate to see it wasted. None of that here which was awesome. We touched on most themes here from ComGuard, AFFC, DCMS, FWLM, the Kungsarme, and even a couple of Periphery entrants. Unfortunately, we really didn’t get a Capellan Ostscout which would have been interesting especially in tandem which the Raven. Perhaps if I can better outline the events of the Salient Horizon setting it will grant you more insight into backstories. I will work on it. Been very busy as of late though and having real trouble getting stuff done. Hope to change this soon. For now, let me talk about our contest here. In addition to no disqualifications there were also no deficient designs. I grouped every entry into three groups. The uniques were personalized or customized Mechs rather than true variants which this competition is really looking for but they can often be inspirational. These highly specialized designs were placed at the bottom here around with contenders for the top spots coming next. Finally, a top three winners circle was established this time around to showcase the very best entries. Without further ado here they all are for my complete review, thanks again everyone!

UNIQUES

11. OTT-80A-X (Abele)
A singular personal model created for Supervisor Arturo Brankovic of the Outworlds Alliance who used every legal and extralegal mean to upgrade his Mech to combat the scourge of piracy. While I liked the story and find it believable out in the poorly defended Periphery the amount of high tech is a bit overboard and could be difficult to just maintain out beyond the InnerSphere’s supply lines. An EndoSteel chassis and 350 XL Engine (10/15/6) highlight that as any maintenance problem could disable this asset for months or even a year as replacement parts are found. Double Heat Sinks and five tons of Ferro-Fibrous (89 factor) are a bit more reasonable to me as are the two Medium Lasers and Flamer added for offensive firepower. Don’t get me wrong I like the story and the design is good but just a bit too far fetched when I think about it critically

10. OTT-7J-Minski (Ice Hellion)
The custom ride of Igor Minski who is currently in the service of Hendrick III or perhaps better be described as possibly still alive but we really don’t know. Thanks Clans, for obliterating those Bandit Scum out there on the Periphery Rim! Slowed down by a 245 Fusion Engine (7/11/7) probably found on a Jenner this design was pretty low tech with a standard chassis, ten Single Heat Sinks, five tons of standard armor plating (80 factor), and a Medium Laser. About the most advanced things going were the Recon Camera, Remote Sensor Dispenser, and three tons of Communications Equipment. Innovative for sure this approach has inspired me to possible Ost-pansion but unfortunately it finished second to last here. Not a bad design for a stand alone custom just might be much for a Bandit King to keep operational – although not impossible.

9. Migite (Bradshaw)
Another highly customized job for a member of the Gunji-no-Kanrei personal lance equipped with all sorts of high-tech communications gear. Using a 280 XL Engine to get a bunch of tons works especially after keeping the standard chassis. Armor protection is low (53 factor) for such a high value target but better with Ferro-Fibrous than standard plating. Unmatched in electronic goodies like seven tons of Communications Gear, a Command Console, and Remote Sensor Dispenser this thing can run a war. Which is sort of my main problem with it as it feels like more of a Command Mech than a Scout Mech. An interesting concept certainly but a bit misguided I feel.

8. OTT-7J-Imp (Ice Hellion)
More of a custom Q Mech in the service of Rasalhague Mechwarrior who fought the Clans and I like it. The Standard chassis and 245 Fusion Engine (7/11/7) likely from a Jenner is a good basis especially when added to ten Double Heat Sinks. These coolers help the pilot control waste heat generated by five Medium Lasers which allow it to pack quite a punch. Five tons of Ferro-Fibrous armor (89 factor) is pretty solid protection but I could see even more for such a fighting Ostscout. The Recon Camera and Remote Sensor Dispenser are good additions and three tons of Communications Equipment might just be the right size for the Ostscout in my opinion. It gives it solid capabilities. This was the finest unique in my opinion and may just spur the growth of a whole new concept. Well done!

CONTENDERS

7. OTT-2DG (Bradshaw)
This Ostscout created for the 2nd Davion Guards would require an extensive renovation in order to work and that more than anything kept it from being place higher. Don’t get me wrong using EndoSteel structure, 350 XL Engine (10/15/4), and a MASC (20) would all dramatically enhance performance but make refits difficult at best. Armed with only a TAG and a Guardian ECM Suite this was another no weapon Ostscout which was a negative too in my opinion. However, Single Heat Sinks do work because of that even though they feel decided low tech compared to the rest of the design. Four and a half tons of Ferro-Fibrous (80 factor) armor are a welcomed increase in protection as well. In the end I liked the idea of the 2nd Davion Guard being outfitted with special Ostscouts but the amount of work on such a limited basis probably makes it too costly at least in my opinion.

6. OTT-8CS (Abele)
This ComGuard designed Ostscout was built to replace losses on Tukayyid and features new EndoSteel structure presumably built on Earth along with a 280 XL Engine (8/12/8). Not opposed to Terran factories being utilized here to spur rapid production as it certainly fits. Three Medium Lasers, two Small Pulses, Double Heat Sinks, Beagle Active Probe, Guardian ECM Suite, and TAG all create a nice functionality which I really like. Six tons of standard armor (96 factor) which dramatically improved field endurance topped it all off. Too bad other designs beat you out Abele cause this one had solid potential, good try!

5. OTT-9J (Irose)
This FWLM upgrade uses a standard chassis and is about the only way to go with the Ostscout as it has been out of production since the early Succession Wars thanks to factory damage. Creation of the 315XL Engine (9/14/9) which would boost productivity maybe difficult even though I like it being derived from the Hermes 300 XL. If the Hermes brand was a subcontractor say then its products and a partnership with Kong makes sense. The Guardian ECM, Beagle Active Probe, TAG, and Remote Sensor System all make great sense here as a great electronics package. Four tons of Jollassa-328 Ferro-Fibrous (71 factor) armor is a nice addition and improves overall protection somewhat. I am not a fan of the no weapon BattleMech because it feels limited somehow with little in the way to actually defend itself but it is not entirely unwarranted when it comes to the Ostscout. Not bad Irose unfortunately you just got beat out by better competition this time around.

4. OTT-8K (Abele)
Presumably a Draconis Combine variant this design uses an EndoSteel chassis as well a 280 XL Engine (8/12/8). The EndoSteel chassis might be the biggest challenge to overcome in production and it is tough to say where that could have come from I like that it is more offensively minded with four Medium Lasers added to an impressive electronics package that includes a Beagle Active Probe, Guardian ECM Suite, TAG, and C3 Slave. Double Heat Sinks are a must with jump movement and those four Laser adding up to twenty heat every Alpha Strike. Six tons of standard armor (96 factor) is a nice improvement in protection and this variant nearly made it across as the official Kurita version. Unfortunately other entries just beat you out but very close here Abele, almost a winner.

WINNERS

3. OTT-K1 (Bradshaw)
I liked this Kong Interstellar gamble to expand which gets its VOX 280 XL Engine from nearby Irian BattleMechs Unlimited. While this component doesn’t appear to be in production currently the business alliance does make a certain amount of sense even given the 3rd Marik Civil War going on at the time. The Standard Chassis and Single Heat Sinks are good building blocks which can work from the original design. Five tons of ferro-fibrous (89 factor) armor for enhanced protection works as do the two Anti-Missile Systems which are supplied by two tons of ammo and further protected by a CASE. While I was not a fan of the unarmed Ostscout it was these defensive systems which won me over eventually as the FWLM is becoming more missile reliant at the time and such a BattleMech would benefit from their addition. Two Sensor Dispensers is a bit of overkill in my opinion but works in the case of the Ostscout as does the Beagle Active Probe and Guardian ECM Suite. Lastly the TAG works for spotting duties and can be swapped for a C3 Slave on the Draconis version which is a nice touch. A couple of flaws but the best unarmed Ostscout in my opinion which is good enough for the bronze, nice stuff Bradshaw!

2. OTT-8OM (Ice Hellion)
This ComStar reconstruction effort in the Rasalhague rump state by Odin Manufacturing is a simple speed up of actual canon events. The OTT-9CS wasn’t introduced for another decade in the base BattleTech timeline but might be feasibly hastened here. While the Krupp 255 EndoSteel would still have to be built from the ground up and probably be the toughest challenge for this project to overcome the motivators are all there. ComStar and its Republic protectorate is trying to strengthen themselves in the event of a Clan advance as in canon but I haven’t shared with everyone the Martial Accords. So named for the Precentor Martial who halted the Clan invasion at Tukayyid and was the result of a successful negotiations of 3053 in the Salient Horizons setting thanks to the Third Marik Civil War. More on this later but if these talks were successful and resulted in a formal alliance of the InnerSphere powers (save the Free Worlds League and the Capellan Confederation) such a focused project may have indeed paid off here so I will allow it. The rest falls into place with the VOX 280 XL Engine (8/12/8) coming from the Venom and even a MASC (16) being introduced here. Double Heat Sinks fir easily in the engine even if they are only cooling off a Medium Laser. The Beagle Active Probe, Guardian ECM Suite, TAG, and Remote Sensor Dispenser all work as high-tech surveillance equipment that would aid the Ostscout in its mission. Love the seven and half tons of standard armor (119 factor) even if it is a slight overage which protects the BattleMech effectively. The armed OTT-8aOM variant is effective but I am wondering if the MASC is what would be dropped here? The TAG for starters is easily replaced by a Medium Laser if no artillery is available. And I have a level three mind to include a cutting-edge model featuring the Exterminators stealth systems here too. In any event the fluff is excellent and the concept is a winner in my opinion. Congratulations Ice on second prize this time around!!

1. OTT-9Q (Irose)
Really liked this variant which eludes to battle damage and simple entropy plausibly creating an Ostscout with teeth. This concept is just something I can see the Fox ordering up for the AFFC at this difficult time in its history. Your expecting to find a poorly or entirely unarmed Ostscout and surprise this ER Large wielding beast with five Medium Lasers in support opens up on ya. No problem I’ll just hit it a few times and it will go down thanks to its tissue paper armor. Wrong again, as it has six and half tons of ferro-fibrous (116 factor) providing near full protection for this thirty-five-ton BattleMech. It does sacrifice jump jets for these enhanced abilities which is perhaps a way of distinguishing Q from its weaker but mobile brethren. Granted the cost is more thanks to the 280 XL Engine (8/12) but I think it is worth it just to put the fear of god into some poor buggers mind that this could be a 9Q your screwing with. First prize and the Ost-gold medal winner here to Irose, well done!!!
« Last Edit: February 08, 2020, 03:05:56 PM by Takiro »
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Bradshaw

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Re: Optimizing the Ostscout
« Reply #38 on: February 08, 2020, 03:04:08 PM »

Nice

In regards to overkill the 60 sensors it can deploy is equivalent to a 120 km sensor net. Which would give roughly one hour advanced notice for most scout mech speed.

In regards to engine Owen's uses in 3056 but one would assume trials are already underway and would have to have engines being produced for that and because production isn't in full yet for it spares could be sold to Kong
« Last Edit: February 08, 2020, 03:06:51 PM by Bradshaw »
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Takiro

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Re: Optimizing the Ostscout
« Reply #39 on: February 08, 2020, 03:07:08 PM »

In regards to overkill the 60 sensors it can deploy is equivalent to a 120 km sensor net. Which would give roughly one hour advanced notice for most scout mech speed.

Good to know!
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Ice Hellion

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Re: Optimizing the Ostscout
« Reply #40 on: February 08, 2020, 03:16:19 PM »

Congratulations Irose.

The Ostscout has a difficult place in militaries as it is a Scout 'Mech, which in the modern era against the Clans is a difficult one.
The real question is would the Successor States really waste resources to produce them?
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"In turn they tested each Clan namesake
in trial against the Ice Hellion's mettle.
Each chased the Ice Hellion, hunting it down.
All failed to match the predator's speed and grace.
Khan Cage smiled and said, "And that is how we shall be."

The Remembrance (Clan Ice Hellion) Passage 5, Verse 3, Lines 1 - 5

Bradshaw

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Re: Optimizing the Ostscout
« Reply #41 on: February 08, 2020, 03:18:44 PM »

I think when stealth armor becomes available it would make more sense for production for refits I couldn't see the harm in seeing their effectiveness
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lrose

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Re: Optimizing the Ostscout
« Reply #42 on: February 08, 2020, 06:48:29 PM »

When I designed the -9J I went with a larger engine because I wanted an Ostscout with all the electronic bells and whistles but no armament - I thought the rational for removing the medium laser made a lot of sense.  The problem was the 280XL would leave too much weight that I did not know what to do with.  I never thought of putting on AMS.  Then I saw Bradshaw's design and was jealous about how much better it was then mine. 
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Bradshaw

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Re: Optimizing the Ostscout
« Reply #43 on: February 08, 2020, 06:58:31 PM »

When I designed the -9J I went with a larger engine because I wanted an Ostscout with all the electronic bells and whistles but no armament - I thought the rational for removing the medium laser made a lot of sense.  The problem was the 280XL would leave too much weight that I did not know what to do with.  I never thought of putting on AMS.  Then I saw Bradshaw's design and was jealous about how much better it was then mine. 

High praise to hear that. I saw yours first and was like damn that's almost what I want but with 310 engine I lose a ton because of gyro rules. What can I do to make something with no weaponry better with tons I was thinking armor at first and then remembered the new anti missile system rules and said why not one for front and one from rear to double down on defense.
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Ice Hellion

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Re: Optimizing the Ostscout
« Reply #44 on: February 09, 2020, 02:49:42 AM »

remembered the new anti missile system rules

It seems I didn't take a look at them.
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"In turn they tested each Clan namesake
in trial against the Ice Hellion's mettle.
Each chased the Ice Hellion, hunting it down.
All failed to match the predator's speed and grace.
Khan Cage smiled and said, "And that is how we shall be."

The Remembrance (Clan Ice Hellion) Passage 5, Verse 3, Lines 1 - 5
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