OBT Forum

Takiro Rim Successor States! « on: October 11, 2009, 08:36:29 PM »

Okay folks time for your input using the known Rim Worlds in 2785, I included the map again for this purpose. We know the Lyran Commonwealth has occupied 95 Rim Worlds and the Terrans have established a Rim Protectorate of 35 systems. That leaves 113 Rim Worlds that have gone their own way and gives us room to play with.  Wink We have some examples from canon.

Chaineline Isles - have these early successor duchies come into being in 2785? (non canon map created prior to HBMPS that gives a vague indication of the size of this state)
Von Strang's World - apparently known as Erin this world has apparently come under the rule of Von Strang
Circinus - in the future it becomes a state but what of 2785 and the Black Warriors?
Elissa - just outside the Rim Protectorate what is going on here?
Rack and Pain - Hopper Morrison gang of Extractors sets up here in the far future
Rim Collection - another far future state but what is going on there now?
Finmark and Erdvynn - the only two unoccupied Provincial capitals likely something of a small state around there if anywhere but that is just my impression

So what are your thoughts? Have I missed a canon example to be considered? Do you have more thoughts on the examples provided? How about a story thread to be considered? Have fun!!



* HBMPS Rim Map 2750.JPG (124.61 KB, 707x916 - viewed 17 times.)

* Chainlane Isles (Non-Canon).JPG (60.85 KB, 1048x748 - viewed 14 times.)

LordGrayson Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #1 on: October 11, 2009, 10:13:10 PM »

Rim Collection - another far future state but what is going on there now?
Finmark and Erdvynn - the only two unoccupied Provincial capitals likely something of a small state around there if anywhere but that is just my impression


 I got to to agree with u that the two capitals would join up and take over control of the Timbuktu provincial worlds not taken over by the LCAF's simply for the  need to survive as I get the general idea alot of the RWR worlds are closer to colonies(not truly able to take care of them selfs) then to actual independent worlds with the ability to survive alone.( U get a smaller RWR thats fighting for its life but doesn't have any real threats to them other then them selfs and the pirates)
  or
 You might end up with two actual states one for each of the Capitals that takes take over control of worlds left in the Timbuktu provincial and start fighting over the worlds left as the two proto-nations fight for their lives to survive (off course the LC/Loki would help play off the two against each other to get cheap material and keep them from reforming a proto-RWR and attempting to take back their lost worlds)
 
 Theses guys would most likely have the largest military in the Rim outside of the main players with 1-4 mech regiments and a few dozen inf and armor regiments split between them or together as one nation not alot of troops but they did lose the war and their nation is going down the drain. (if left alone they'd likely die off  in a decade or 2 but with the Rim Protector/TR and LC in need of war material and the need to secure there border {ones a TR the others a LC problem} so to deal with SW they might actually get the support and help they need to survive and last.

 On the Rim Collection isn't that nation/worlds at or around the Erdvynn provincial area or am I thinking of the wrong nation that's sits at the end of the area near the FWL and LC's area in 3050. if it is they might just be more colony worlds for the Erdvynn prov.

lrose Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #2 on: October 12, 2009, 05:55:40 AM »

Quote from: Takiro on October 11, 2009, 08:36:29 PM
Chaineline Isles - have these early successor duchies come into being in 2785? (non canon map created prior to HBMPS that gives a vague indication of the size of this state)

I'd say they are forming around this time but don't exist in their final form yet.

Quote
Circinus - in the future it becomes a state but what of 2785 and the Black Warriors?

Forms in 2785 per canon when Lyran farmers fleeing the fighting arrive on planet and make an agreement with the black warriors. It remains a 1 workd nation until the 2990s when they colonize several new worlds and recolonize several abandoned RWR worlds.


Quote
Elissa - just outside the Rim Protectorate what is going on here?

Probably subsistance farming and barely surviving.

Quote
Rim Collection - another far future state but what is going on there now?

6 independent worlds that may have a little trade with each other.  All are holding on but are very vulnerable to pirates.  Occassionally they discuss alliances but nothing ever comes of it.

Quote
Finmark and Erdvynn - the only two unoccupied Provincial capitals likely something of a small state around there if anywhere but that is just my impression

Sounds reasonable to me.

Quote
So what are your thoughts? Have I missed a canon example to be considered? Do you have more thoughts on the examples provided? How about a story thread to be considered? Have fun!!

You caught all of the major states that I am aware of.

Takiro Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #3 on: October 12, 2009, 10:06:17 AM »

Your right LordGrayson a good question that I think we've started to answer by canon example is what worlds were self sufficient and what were struggling colonies. The earlier map of the RWR in HBMPS might answer that question better. I assume that worlds around since 2570 would be more apt to be self sufficient then worlds that did not.

Quote from: lrose on October 12, 2009, 05:55:40 AM
I'd say they are forming around this time but don't exist in their final form yet.

Any ideas on what Rim Worlds belong to the Chaineline Isles at this time? Likely no to little Mechs with the same story for Jumpships.

Quote from: lrose on October 12, 2009, 05:55:40 AM
Forms in 2785 per canon when Lyran farmers fleeing the fighting arrive on planet and make an agreement with the black warriors. It remains a 1 workd nation until the 2990s when they colonize several new worlds and recolonize several abandoned RWR worlds.

Excellent, the Black Warriors are yet another bandit group I have for the region at this time. Also from canon are the Belt Pirates of Star's End (yes they are in the Rim Protectorate so I'm thinking of how I can properly integrate them). Two of my creations would be the Star Vikings perhaps operating from Elissa who are composed of Rasalhague freedom fighters and the Theban Legion operating in the Anti Spinward Arm of the Old Republic. The Legion is a Separatist some say Anarchist group based loosely on the founder of the Rim Worlds unit. Perhaps the commander is or claims to be a Rowe - some adore them as freedom fighters and others despise them as murders.

Quote from: lrose on October 12, 2009, 05:55:40 AM
6 independent worlds that may have a little trade with each other.  All are holding on but are very vulnerable to pirates.  Occassionally they discuss alliances but nothing ever comes of it.

LordGrayson if you look at the 2750 I posted you'll see that the worlds of the Rim Collection are in the Timbuktu Province of the Rim Worlds Republic. I think this union or talk of this union might be the best chance for order in the region.

Irose did you tell me that some of the Rim Collection worlds are missing from the HBMPS map? Actually I was thinking of a pair (2) precursor alliances that may have 3-4 worlds based on Republican or even Separatist ideals. Problem is they have little or no Mech support.

I could also see talk of unity but nothing ever coming of it as a possibilty. Could write it as a still borne Rim Collective which was assembling but external pressures and the lack of a Mech Force and Jumpships kill it before it forms. We could discuss Terran efforts to help? Maybe not wanted or just too far away. Lyran involvement perhaps the Archon symapthizes can't do much as she is up to her eyeballs in pre-war problems and local Lyran Lords screw with them.


For the regional states of Finmark and Erdvynn I see them as being ruled by their ambitious Provincial Governors who both recognize that the Republic is doomed. They try to become states of their own but in what form? I think Finmark would be a little more powerful then Erdvynn. I'd love to get thoughts on size and style of governments here. I doubt local Lyran Lords would want these two states around as they might try to reclaim their worlds.

I do agree with LordGrayson that these two Provincial states would have the largest military force left in the Rim Worlds aside from the Rim Protectorate. To be honest I don't see them with more then 2 BattleMech regiments cobbled together from pretty poor sources. Their supplies are likely scarce and yes they are supported by a dozen or so conventional regiments with a few wings of aerospace fighters. The few rare Jumpships remaining are likely under their direct control, not many though.

Hessian Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #4 on: October 12, 2009, 12:59:16 PM »

Quote from: Takiro on October 11, 2009, 08:36:29 PM
Chaineline Isles - have these early successor duchies come into being in 2785? (non canon map created prior to HBMPS that gives a vague indication of the size of this state)

Rim Collection - another far future state but what is going on there now?

In both cases I agree with Irose.

Quote from: Takiro on October 11, 2009, 08:36:29 PM
Finmark and Erdvynn - the only two unoccupied Provincial capitals likely something of a small state around there if anywhere but that is just my impression

I guess that both Erdvynn and Finmark become the nucleus for a mini-state.
I'd make those states not too large though in order to leave room for the separatists that seek total planetary indepence.
Perhaps one of said mini-states is controlled by Amaris Loyalists, the other by Republicans(additionally this way both groups have a base from which to operate)
However I cannot see them join up and forming a single combined state(the distances involved and the number of planets are in my opinion too large)

Regarding Elissa and Von Strang's World I'd assume these worlds just trie to survive (barely) on their own .

Ciao
Hessian

P.S.:
Regarding types of government: An Amaris Loyalist government is probably a carbon-copy of the Amaris RWR, while a Republican government is more, well, democratic. Either a true Republic or an elective constitutional monarchy.

Ice Hellion Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #5 on: October 12, 2009, 03:43:16 PM »

To me, those planets scream Chaos March  Grin

Quote from: Hessian on October 12, 2009, 12:59:16 PM
Regarding types of government: An Amaris Loyalist government is probably a carbon-copy of the Amaris RWR, while a Republican government is more, well, democratic. Either a true Republic or an elective constitutional monarchy.

For a "Republican" government, what about using the Roman Republic as a model or the Greek cities?

Takiro  Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #6 on: October 12, 2009, 04:02:01 PM »

An excellent comparison Ice, the Chaos March was however much more developed then these Rim Worlds and far less spread out.

The original Rim Republic was based on Plato's ideals I believe.

Ice Hellion Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #7 on: October 12, 2009, 04:15:30 PM »

Quote from: Takiro on October 12, 2009, 04:02:01 PM
An excellent comparison Ice, the Chaos March was however much more developed then these Rim Worlds and far less spread out.

But it was my best CBT example of a complete mess.

Quote from: Takiro on October 12, 2009, 04:02:01 PM
The original Rim Republic was based on Plato's ideals I believe.

I remember reading something like this somewhere but according to what I remember of Plato's ideas, it was a twisted version of his ideas.

lrose Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #8 on: October 12, 2009, 05:01:21 PM »

Quote from: Takiro on October 12, 2009, 10:06:17 AM
Your right LordGrayson a good question that I think we've started to answer by canon example is what worlds were self sufficient and what were struggling colonies. The earlier map of the RWR in HBMPS might answer that question better. I assume that worlds around since 2570 would be more apt to be self sufficient then worlds that did not.

Agreed

Quote
Any ideas on what Rim Worlds belong to the Chaineline Isles at this time? Likely no to little Mechs with the same story for Jumpships.

Not sure- they may all be some of the secret colonies that Amaris set up- my guess is jumpships are rare- but largely on purpose by keeping the worlds depended his transport Amaris can insure their loyalty.

Quote
Excellent, the Black Warriors are yet another bandit group I have for the region at this time. Also from canon are the Belt Pirates of Star's End (yes they are in the Rim Protectorate so I'm thinking of how I can properly integrate them). Two of my creations would be the Star Vikings perhaps operating from Elissa who are composed of Rasalhague freedom fighters and the Theban Legion operating in the Anti Spinward Arm of the Old Republic. The Legion is a Separatist some say Anarchist group based loosely on the founder of the Rim Worlds unit. Perhaps the commander is or claims to be a Rowe - some adore them as freedom fighters and others despise them as murders.

I have lots of notes on the Black Warriors/Circinius I'll pass them along later. I have a few ideas on the Belt Pirates- some of the periphery books imply that the Belt Pirates hid in the Star's End System right under the nose of the SL- it seems that Star's End system has huge numbers of asteroids & debris.  I would not put much on Elissa in 3025 it is a pacifist world that is just barely surviving.


Quote
Irose did you tell me that some of the Rim Collection worlds are missing from the HBMPS map? Actually I was thinking of a pair (2) precursor alliances that may have 3-4 worlds based on Republican or even Separatist ideals. Problem is they have little or no Mech support.

I could also see talk of unity but nothing ever coming of it as a possibilty. Could write it as a still borne Rim Collective which was assembling but external pressures and the lack of a Mech Force and Jumpships kill it before it forms. We could discuss Terran efforts to help? Maybe not wanted or just too far away. Lyran involvement perhaps the Archon symapthizes can't do much as she is up to her eyeballs in pre-war problems and local Lyran Lords screw with them.


2 worlds are missing from the 2750 map- I can't remember which ones of the top of my head. I would not have any sort of alliance at this point- the periphery books say that these worlds did not until the 3040 or 50s.  On the other hand these worlds are true believers in the real RWR- i.e. not the one that Amaris created.

Quote
For the regional states of Finmark and Erdvynn I see them as being ruled by their ambitious Provincial Governors who both recognize that the Republic is doomed. They try to become states of their own but in what form? I think Finmark would be a little more powerful then Erdvynn. I'd love to get thoughts on size and style of governments here. I doubt local Lyran Lords would want these two states around as they might try to reclaim their worlds.

I do agree with LordGrayson that these two Provincial states would have the largest military force left in the Rim Worlds aside from the Rim Protectorate. To be honest I don't see them with more then 2 BattleMech regiments cobbled together from pretty poor sources. Their supplies are likely scarce and yes they are supported by a dozen or so conventional regiments with a few wings of aerospace fighters. The few rare Jumpships remaining are likely under their direct control, not many though.

With Finmark & Erdvynn what I would love to see is one nation is Amaris Loyalists, the other is Rim Republicans.  Then 2 states are opposed to each other (they each see themselves as the true successor to the RWR) - the Lyrans may actually be helping both sides since it keeps them fighting each other and not bothering the LC.  The militaries are small- the Loyalist state (Erdvynn?) is composed of members of the RWR forces who survived the Coup and Kerensky- they have a larger mech force (maybe 2 regiments) and a smaller conventional army. The Rim Republican state has a large conventional army - mostly militia and small battlemech corps -2-3 battalions.  Jumpships are scarce in both states but slightly more common in the Loyalist state. Both states may have access to 1 or 2 of the surviving secret weapons factories.  I really like the potential here and we should look into it further.

Takiro Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #9 on: October 12, 2009, 07:16:45 PM »

I look forward to seeing your notes on the Black Warriors/Circinius.

As for the Belt Pirates hiding under the nose of the Star League that is pretty impressive especially since the First Lord visited there. You think they are hiding from the Protectorate still? Waiting for the right time to strike? Or do or have they worked with authorities over time to simply survive.

Elissa wouldn't be much more than a base world for bandits and a developing point of the Inheritors.

I'm liking the alliance that never was in regards to the Rim Collection. In the wake of Timbuktu's fall to the Lyran Commonwealth these worlds talk seriously about uniting in the Republican tradition but there is just too much for them to overcome. External pressures like Lyran involvement and internal issues like a Separatist under toe  or disagreements over the form of federal government.

I'm seeing Finmark as the Amaris Loyalist state simply because its central position breaks up the Republican cause which is strong in the Rim Protectorate and the Rim Collection. If Finmark was also Republican you could have a much larger Protectorate which I just don't see. Plus I have storyline reasons to be revealed later that play in nicely with this development. Thinking of using the title Proconsul for the ruler of Finmark. Any suggestions for a second name? Don't see Republic something to signify the Amaris Empire?

Erdvynn I see as more of the Colonial Republicans perhaps closely tied to the Free Worlds League or more precisely the Bolan Association who is attempting with its limited resources to encircle and raid the Lyran Polsobu Thumb. In much the same fashion that Hasseldorf forces the FWLM from the Bolan Thumb but without the proper support. Another reason for the strength of the Republican cause here is the proximity to Circinus even though I see those factions as very separate states taking two different paths.

lrose Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #10 on: October 12, 2009, 07:39:05 PM »

Quote from: Takiro on October 12, 2009, 07:16:45 PM
I look forward to seeing your notes on the Black Warriors/Circinius.

I'll send it to you later.

Quote
As for the Belt Pirates hiding under the nose of the Star League that is pretty impressive especially since the First Lord visited there. You think they are hiding from the Protectorate still? Waiting for the right time to strike? Or do or have they worked with authorities over time to simply survive.

See HBMPS p. 37 first full paragraph on the right column.  There may be more references- I have to check my notes.

Quote
I'm liking the alliance that never was in regards to the Rim Collection. In the wake of Timbuktu's fall to the Lyran Commonwealth these worlds talk seriously about uniting in the Republican tradition but there is just too much for them to overcome. External pressures like Lyran involvement and internal issues like a Separatist under toe  or disagreements over the form of federal government.
Okay

Quote
I'm seeing Finmark as the Amaris Loyalist state simply because its central position breaks up the Republican cause which is strong in the Rim Protectorate and the Rim Collection. If Finmark was also Republican you could have a much larger Protectorate which I just don't see. Plus I have storyline reasons to be revealed later that play in nicely with this development. Thinking of using the title Proconsul for the ruler of Finmark. Any suggestions for a second name? Don't see Republic something to signify the Amaris Empire?

Erdvynn I see as more of the Colonial Republicans perhaps closely tied to the Free Worlds League or more precisely the Bolan Association who is attempting with its limited resources to encircle and raid the Lyran Polsobu Thumb. In much the same fashion that Hasseldorf forces the FWLM from the Bolan Thumb but without the proper support. Another reason for the strength of the Republican cause here is the proximity to Circinus even though I see those factions as very separate states taking two different paths.

My thinking was the opposite- Finmark was old worlds with people who remember the old days while Erdvynn was newly colonized worlds settled by those supporting Amaris.  What you are suggesting works for me.

Takiro Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #11 on: October 12, 2009, 09:09:34 PM »

Quote from: lrose on October 12, 2009, 07:39:05 PM
My thinking was the opposite- Finmark was old worlds with people who remember the old days while Erdvynn was newly colonized worlds settled by those supporting Amaris.  What you are suggesting works for me.

That is a good point Irose. I would say that it looks like Finmark looks like the second province of the Rim Worlds, Timbuktu was the third, and obviously the Erdvynn was the fourth and final Province formed during the Star League era. Page 45 of the original Periphery SB under Second Invasion the last paragraph speaks of a wave ne'er do wells immigrated to the Periphery between 2610 and 2680from the InnerSphere. These societal castoffs robbed the Periphery of its hard working ethic. Now I could read some bias into that but these don't sound like the people who settle new worlds rather old ones. Leeches who suck dry existing structure - what I'm saying is the Erdvynn Province could have been a case of "Rim Worlder" flight. I do see the Amaris clan using these dregs as an instrument to rebuilding its shattered power base after the Reunification War ends. These bums becoming some of his most fanatical fanatics. Then again you have my Terran immigrant theory in addition to this canon tidbit but thought I'd comment.

Also analyzed the Rim Worlds Republic map (seen in HBMPS) after the Age of War (2571) and there are 74 worlds colonized at this time. The Apollo Province has 43 worlds of which 27 are occupied by the Lyrans, 12 fall under Terran protection and 4 go independent. The Finmark Province had only 12 worlds half of which were occupied by the Lyrans while the others are independent. The Timbuktu Province (which I modified to look at Erdvynn) has 14 worlds - 11 occupied by the Lyrans while 3 go independent (2 of which are Rim Collection worlds). While the Erdvynn Province didn't exist in 2571 five of its worlds were settled at this time - 3 were occupied by the Lyrans and 2 go independent. 47 of the 74 Rim Worlds fall under Lyran occupation, 12 fall under Terran protection and 15 are Independent in 2785.

Takiro Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #12 on: October 14, 2009, 12:13:24 PM »

How is this?

Rim Successor States
While the old Republic has nearly disappeared in all but name its presence still lingers on despite the absence of any real instrument of state. A vengeful assault by the SLDF combined with the Rim Republican Army (RRA) revolution toppled Regent Mohammed Selim and his pro-Amaris government in 2767. For a time it appeared as if a renewed Republic would take root but the departure of Kerensky bought Amaris reactionaries out of the wood work. Sick of interstellar power struggles the Rim Separatists promising real individual freedom also appeared on the scene. While these factions fought for control Archon Robert Steiner II moved to “keep the peace”. Fighting Lyran invaders and Amaris fanatics proved to be too much for the Republicans. The seizure of Apollo by the LCAF in 2775 decapitated their national government and saw President Lucien Dormax disappear into the custody of the LIC. With the Rim Parliament also held captive on the “capital world” little remained of the Rim Worlds bureaucracy. A unified Republican defense headquartered on Finmark by General Frances Hawk continued until early 2785. The evacuation of Finmark by General Hawk and the Republicans effectively ended any national defense and has ushered in a new regionalism. Several micro states have recently emerged usually centering on the Republic’s old Provincial capitals. Many debate if these remnants are truly independent entities as they have yet to declare their independence or even seek interstellar recognition. However, these rising powers appear well placed to play a growing role in Rim events over the next few years. It remains to be seen if these mini states will ever stabilize or become viable nations.

Finmark Remnant – Self styled Proconsul Marcus Audens has become the leading Amaris Loyalist. This eleven world (Finmark, Lushun, Austerlitz, Oporto, Anatolla, Edirne, Lywick, Viluisk, Delagoa, Torgvei, Nyasa) rump state is the last multi-world Province of the Amaris Empire. Recently ousting native Republicans the Remnant is a bastion of the Loyalist cause which seeks to restore the Empire. The Proconsul still faces many problems including a Separatist revolt on Edirne, Lyran aggression, increasing bandit attacks, and the presence of the Rim Protectorate. Supported by two BattleMech regiments, five aerospace wings, ten jumpships, and over a dozen conventional regiments this micro-state could become a much bigger player on the Rim.

Erdvynn Alliance – Governor Joseph Farnsworth has managed to hold together this seven world (Milvano, Nightwish, Erdvynn, Tatopani, Calvados, Yidtall, Choex) defense pact centered around the Rim’s newest Provincial capital. These Colonial Republicans are closely tied to the Free Worlds League or more precisely the Bolan Association who are seeking new allies in the face of Lyran aggression. Fielding a single BattleMech regiment along with about half a dozen conventional regiments this provisional alliance maybe too weak to aid the Marik cause.

Hessian Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #13 on: October 14, 2009, 12:35:28 PM »

Sounds good to me Takiro, though I must say that Finmark Remnant sounds to much like Star Wars(=SWish) in my ears. But perhaps that's just me....

Takiro Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #14 on: October 14, 2009, 12:40:23 PM »

True, true - I'm open to another name signifying its imperial status. Also remember that the region still refers to itself as the Finmark Province of the Amaris Empire so calling the such and such remnant is an oiutsiders observation of what is developing.

Hessian Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #15 on: October 14, 2009, 12:50:33 PM »

How sounds the Rim Worlds Empire?

Rainbow 6 Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #16 on: October 14, 2009, 01:47:59 PM »

Or why not have it continue to use the Rim Worlds Republic name?

Ice Hellion Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #17 on: October 14, 2009, 05:37:03 PM »

Quote
The evacuation of Finmark by General Hawk and the Republicans effectively ended any national defense and has ushered in a new regionalism.

The occupation by Amaris loyalists is not really clear in this sentence.
I thought they were evacuating the planet because of Lyran pressure and I then found out that it was Amaris loyalists one.

And for the name, why not go for the Finmark Republic?
I am just following the idea behind the Rim Worlds Republic  Grin

Rainbow 6 Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #18 on: October 15, 2009, 03:28:40 PM »

Quote from: Ice Hellion on October 14, 2009, 05:37:03 PM
The occupation by Amaris loyalists is not really clear in this sentence.
I thought they were evacuating the planet because of Lyran pressure and I then found out that it was Amaris loyalists one.

And for the name, why not go for the Finmark Republic?
I am just following the idea behind the Rim Worlds Republic  Grin

Finmark Republic sounds like a good choice.

Brings in the name of the new states capital together with the Republican name for continuality.

Takiro Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #19 on: October 15, 2009, 09:51:26 PM »

That would be fine. Remember these states likely haven't even crossed the threshold of self governance yet. They believe that the Republic is still around and technically they are right even though it is on life support with people scrambling to pull the plug.

Highland Ranger Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #20 on: December 03, 2009, 04:25:21 AM »

The two Rim Collection (3048) planets missing from the 2750 RWR HB:MPS map are Otisberg and Waypoint.


When I was playing around with my own alternate Rim Protectorate, I used the title Governor General for the highest position.  It was based on the fact that a former RWR General had formed my Rim Protectorate to protect it from LC expansion in 2774 using troops loyal to the RWR and it's citizens not loyality to Amaris first.

Governor General is a term used in the British Commonwealth and indicates the Queen's ( or King's ) representative in the commonwealth member nation.

I've always liked that the 3048 Rim Collection was a Democracy.



From what I have read Elissa is described as having a pacifist population based on self-sustaining agriculture with little or no high-tech equipment.  One of the invading clan source books stated that the conquering clan ( I don't remember which one ) believed there there was a Star League base hidden on planet but after several weeks of searching they were unable to find it.



Do you have access to the Star Corps Dossiers / Masters and Minions ?  It gives a 3/4 page description of Stars End and the Hells Horses campaign to capture the system.

a couple of excerpts.


"The system was settled by refugees fleeing the Rim Worlds Republic to avoid persecution at the hands of the Republic’s restored ruling
family following the Reunification War.  For nearly two centuries they enjoyed a relatively prosperous existence mining rich lanthanum and germanium deposits while the Lyran Commonwealth and Rim Worlds Republic bickered over who actually had the rights to the system. Even as the Star League failed, the Belt became tapped out. "

"Thus the swirling rocks of the Belt became a haven of sorts for technicians with the skills to build and repair JumpShips and DropShips. Hidden within the Belt are zero-G graving docks and hangars capable of assembling JumpShips and many of their components."


Hope this helps.  I'm a great fan of the RWR and the Rim Collection and any effort to have them represented in any universe, fan or canon.

Takiro Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #21 on: December 03, 2009, 06:45:51 AM »

Welcome Highland Ranger!

I was going to name their leader Protector for the Protectorate but Governor General might do. Sounds Director Generalish.

I'm trying to incorporate everyone's ideas on the Rim Protectorate so keep them coming.

Highland Ranger Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #22 on: December 03, 2009, 07:10:30 AM »

I thought about protector and a few others.   Protector is already used in the TC from memory ?  Protector Grover Shrapnel springs to mind.  I wanted something unique.

for my own creation it made sense.  the Liberating General was voted in as the first governor.   Also the news just had an article about the Victorian Governor General at the time.

I made up one of those entries like in Total Warfare and even came up with a bunch of industries and custom vehicles.  Very over the top for a small nation but I was genuinely inspired by your work here.  Unfortunately it never went anywhere but it was fun putting it together.  This was all done before the HB:MPS came out.

The planet descriptions are all gathered fragments from canon sources with some of my custom stuff added at the end.  Ambrosa Cluster is the description from the Enders Cluster.  Years ago I found a txt file called Encyclopedia Galactica where someone had compiled all these descriptions.  My copy is dated 2006, so it is at least that old and covers very few of the periphery planets and virtually no RWR planets.

Hope some of this can be of help.

cheers.
* Rim Protectorate Manufacturing 3031.doc (36.5 KB - downloaded 4 times.)
* Rim Protectorate Worlds 3031.doc (45 KB - downloaded 6 times.)

Takiro Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #23 on: December 03, 2009, 06:09:43 PM »

Thanks, I'll give it a look and use what I can.  Wink

Highland Ranger Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #24 on: December 03, 2009, 08:25:03 PM »

have you placed any of the RWR factories yet ?  I'm putting some note together for a campaign based on Shattered Dawn and would like to stay "canon" as much as possible.

Takiro Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #25 on: December 03, 2009, 08:35:08 PM »

I haven't as of yet placed any RWR factories but it is on my to do list. Plus you have to remember Project Phoenix might have dismantled and moved industry in the BTSD scheme of things.

Highland Ranger Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #26 on: December 03, 2009, 08:45:04 PM »

Quote from: Takiro on December 03, 2009, 08:35:08 PM
Project Phoenix might have dismantled and moved industry in the BTSD scheme of things.

that was essentially my question.


another question, is the Rim Protectorate governed by the Terran Hegemony ( or it's successor ) or is it fully independent of the TH and self governed ?

is the Rim Protectorate pro republic ie anti Amaris loyalist ?

is the Rim Protectorate hiring mercs, under what conditions, for what types of missions ?

Takiro Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #27 on: December 03, 2009, 09:16:57 PM »

Quote from: Highland Ranger on December 03, 2009, 08:45:04 PM
another question, is the Rim Protectorate governed by the Terran Hegemony ( or it's successor ) or is it fully independent of the TH and self governed ?

In theory it is governed by Terra but in practice it has to be self sufficient because of the distance. The Governor-General is the true executive authority of the Protectorate even though Regent Amanda Cameron is their sovereign. Legislative power is currently wielded by the Rim Directorate of Project Phoenix who is tasked with the reconstruction of the Protectorate.

Quote from: Highland Ranger on December 03, 2009, 08:45:04 PM
is the Rim Protectorate pro republic ie anti Amaris loyalist ?

The Rim Protectorate is stronghold of the Republican faction under Terran protection. See the links below for more information on these players.

Rim Factions
http://www.btshattereddawn.com/forums/index.php?topic=33.msg20774#msg20774

Outsiders
http://www.btshattereddawn.com/forums/index.php?topic=33.msg20798#msg20798

Quote from: Highland Ranger on December 03, 2009, 08:45:04 PM
is the Rim Protectorate hiring mercs, under what conditions, for what types of missions ?

Do Privateers count as mercs?  Wink

Highland Ranger Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #28 on: December 06, 2009, 08:34:31 AM »

I've slowly been going through the fan books and through the forums here.

Am I correct in understanding that the Terran Republic is slowly locating all RWR military manufacturing and either dismantling it and shipping it back to the Terran Republic or destroying it if the previous option is not viable ?  And that it is the task of the Journeymen to locate such manufacturing sites and report back on them ?

Takiro Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #29 on: December 06, 2009, 09:14:20 AM »

Quote from: Highland Ranger on December 06, 2009, 08:34:31 AM
Am I correct in understanding that the Terran Republic is slowly locating all RWR military manufacturing and either dismantling it and shipping it back to the Terran Republic or destroying it if the previous option is not viable ?  And that it is the task of the Journeymen to locate such manufacturing sites and report back on them ?

Correct in most part. I hope that the inference on "destroying it if the previous option is not viable" carries through even if that is not the case. Yes the Journeymen of Project Phoenix are roaming the Rim Worlds Republic and the Deep Periphery searching for the Known and Secret Facilities of the Usurper. Upon location of such valuable industry and resources they are judged for their value to continuing task of the rebuilding Terra. If it is worth and can in fact be moved because some stuff is just too old, large or complex to disassemble, transport via drop/jumpship, then reassemble such a task is carried out by Project Phoenix. Think Mega Movers for BTSD. Wink

Now what happened with all that other stuff that could not be moved because of technical difficulty or time constraints. I hope you understand that is part of a mystery I have to leave hanging in the air. You'd have to assume that anything beyond their control would have to be destroyed so it could not be used by the enemies of the Last Cameron. You will see that Illium and Yelmelke at the heart of the Rim Protectorate are the repositories of that which could not make it to the Republic because of time constraints (i.e. the Exodus which crippled transport, the fall of the Star League and the outbreak of hostilities). However, there remains facilities that the Project has confidence in their secrecy and control over.

One of these days I'll have to do a results of Project Phoenix discussing what they found, what they moved, and their overall results. Good stuff!

Highland Ranger Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #30 on: December 06, 2009, 07:05:54 PM »

Quote from: Takiro on December 06, 2009, 09:14:20 AM
Yes the Journeymen of Project Phoenix are roaming the Rim Worlds Republic and the Deep Periphery searching for the Known and Secret Facilities of the Usurper. Upon location of such valuable industry and resources they are judged for their value to continuing task of the rebuilding Terra.


as a loyal son of the Republic, now Protectorate, I believe that the hunting and extermination of said journeymen to be of great national importance.

muttley Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #31 on: December 06, 2009, 08:27:16 PM »

Nope- better to allow them to work but not allow them to report... the Protectorate needs those facilities too.

Takiro Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #32 on: December 06, 2009, 08:50:55 PM »

Well that is the double edge sword there. Republicans are likely to not appreciate Terran efforts to strip their lands of vital industry.

Highland Ranger Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #33 on: December 06, 2009, 09:07:35 PM »

Quote from: muttley on December 06, 2009, 08:27:16 PM
Nope- better to allow them to work but not allow them to report... the Protectorate needs those facilities too.

that works for me.    Wink


then we bring out the Whitworths with Flamethrower variants.  Grin

Highland Ranger Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #34 on: December 07, 2009, 06:40:53 AM »

Is the Mint at Illum still operating ?

if so what currency is it producing ?  ie  SL Dollars, Republic Phoenix, Lyran Kroner, ?

what is the official currency of the Rim Protectorate and what currency(ies) are in use / being accepted and is there a geographical break down if different currencies are being used in different areas.

CJvR Re: Rim Successor States! « Reply #35 on: December 07, 2009, 11:32:49 AM »

Perhaps the Rimmers are slightly upset at the TR moving Amaris surviving facilities and whatever the SLDF constructed. But then without the TR precense the Rim will decay into either total anarchy or it will become a Steiner province so it is hardly as if the options for the Rimmers are much of an improvement.