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Author Topic: Free Guilds = Clan Spacers  (Read 28516 times)

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Takiro

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Free Guilds = Clan Spacers
« on: April 26, 2014, 06:19:17 PM »

Hey gang, I just wanted to start a thread discussing the Free Guilds and what exactly they are in Clan society. Now I am aware that as of now they have been retconned from canon as an error made by Focht (see the link below).

http://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php/topic,16102.0.html

But for the sake of this discussion let’s just say the Free Guilds do exist and Focht didn’t screw up. What do we know?

Quote
Khan Elias Crichell proposed as part of Operation Revival, that in accordance with writings from the Kerensky Archives, that the ilClan assume control of the Free Guilds, which are the merchants, techs, scientists, and other lower castes whose affiliation is to Clan society and not to one Clan. (JFSB pg 21)

Khan Crichell acknowledged the logistical concerns of Commander Jessica Buhallin of Iota Galaxy and Logistics Overseer Tanner Calbot only so far as to order Falcon bankers to contract a few extra transports from the Free Guilds. The Free Guilds, in return for the Falcons' long-standing disdain for their caste, charged that Clan extraordinarily high fees for each ship, while giving the other invasion Clans a far more reasonable rate. (JFSB pg 21)

Free Guilds appears in the Index of the Invading Clans Sourcebook (JFSB pg 21)

The ilClan would assume control of the “Free Guilds” – those elements of the civilian castes that form part of Clan society but do not belong to a specific Clan.(CWoK pg. 18)

So I have always wondered who the Free Guilds are and how/why would the Clans tolerate their existence? The development of Spacer Cultures like the Belters in the Terran system and those mentioned in Historical Operation Klondike got me thinking – could the Free Guilds be Clan Spacers?

It kind of makes sense to me given the terrestrial ‘Mech perspective of the Clans and the BattleTech universe in general. Most everything is ground based and off world societies don’t get much play. Given the only thing we know about this group is that they are an independent or autonomous faction within the Clans and they loan out ships to others I think the Spacer ideal could really work.

I got a bunch of idea seeds I have jotted down for a possible fanon history of this interesting Clan faction but I’d like to know what you think first.
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Ice Hellion

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Re: Free Guilds = Clan Spacers
« Reply #1 on: April 28, 2014, 02:56:31 PM »

Matt had ideas about them.

Why go for Spacers? Why not go for a percentage of the total population directly under the orders of the ilKhan and working for the Clans as a whole?
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"In turn they tested each Clan namesake
in trial against the Ice Hellion's mettle.
Each chased the Ice Hellion, hunting it down.
All failed to match the predator's speed and grace.
Khan Cage smiled and said, "And that is how we shall be."

The Remembrance (Clan Ice Hellion) Passage 5, Verse 3, Lines 1 - 5

skiltao

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Re: Free Guilds = Clan Spacers
« Reply #2 on: May 08, 2014, 05:11:49 PM »

Do we know who's responsible for maintaining and expanding the Clans' system of automated HPGs? (Mentioned in Explorer Corp, I think, if nowhere else.)

That might fall under the Free Guilds' umbrella.
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Dragon Cat

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Re: Free Guilds = Clan Spacers
« Reply #3 on: May 08, 2014, 06:53:04 PM »

Matt had ideas about them.

Why go for Spacers? Why not go for a percentage of the total population directly under the orders of the ilKhan and working for the Clans as a whole?

Not a bad idea... Until there's no ilKhan

Do we know who's responsible for maintaining and expanding the Clans' system of automated HPGs? (Mentioned in Explorer Corp, I think, if nowhere else.)

That might fall under the Free Guilds' umbrella.

I think individual Clans carry the responsibility for that you want an HPG build it you want to use mine a trial will do.  Exploring seemed to be left down to the Sea Fox and Nova Cats during the Golden Century.  I guess you could say the Blood Spirits and Cloud Cobras did a bit as well with the Tainte worlds and the Blood Spirits last stand (can't remember name)

The rest appeared to be happy to fight over what was left
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Really, as long as there is an unbroken line of people calling themselves "Clan Nova Cat," it doesn't really matter to me if they're still using Iron Wombs or not. They may be dead as a faction, but as a people they still exist. It's not uncommon in the real world, after all.

skiltao

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Re: Free Guilds = Clan Spacers
« Reply #4 on: May 09, 2014, 12:35:22 AM »

The Clans maintain an automated HPG network, distributed widely across their part of the periphery. I suppose individual clans could have created different pieces of the network and then Trialed or traded for transmission rights with the others.

PS: I just checked Explorer Corp. It doesn't say who's responsible for the network.
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marauder648

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Re: Free Guilds = Clan Spacers
« Reply #5 on: November 27, 2019, 09:51:12 AM »

Whilst the Free Guilds may have been dropped, having some kind of 'meta organisation' to do a lot of the greasing of Clan society makes sense. I would guess that for the most part, each Clan looks after its own HPG net in their space, but you'd then have multiple HPG's on a single world which is expensive and inefficient as you're having to share most worlds with other Clans.

You'd need something like a 'Free Guilds' to run and administer things like oil refineries etc because these are large, expensive and vulnerable installations and if one Clan controlled them all they could cause issues for the others which in turn would spark Trials which could damage the facility in this example. In return the Free Guild freely trades X resource with ALL the Clans should they need it.


Perhaps have them be loyal to the Grand Council and thus not influenced (ostendibly..) by any one Clan and if there's an ilKhan the Free Guild is loyal to them who is in turn answerable to the Grand Council.

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skiltao

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Re: Free Guilds = Clan Spacers
« Reply #6 on: November 27, 2019, 11:48:29 AM »

The Hall of Khans / Grand Council facilities might need to be staffed by neutral parties.

Is any of the Exodus Fleet still in unclaimed (or otherwise neutral or shared/Council ownership) orbital caches?
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Takiro

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Re: Free Guilds = Clan Spacers
« Reply #7 on: November 27, 2019, 07:20:15 PM »

Whilst the Free Guilds may have been dropped,

Stop right there, what if they weren't dropped! What if they got Reaved?! This Clan without Warriors seems like the perfect breeding place for the Society and its ideals. Not saying every Guilder was in on the conspiracy but the Clans went nuts anyway. Perhaps we no longer hear of the Free Guilds cause they were annihilated. ;)
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marauder648

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Re: Free Guilds = Clan Spacers
« Reply #8 on: November 27, 2019, 11:31:11 PM »

That would make sense. RE them being a breeding ground for the Society.
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Takiro

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Re: Free Guilds = Clan Spacers
« Reply #9 on: November 28, 2019, 09:51:13 AM »

That would make sense. RE them being a breeding ground for the Society.

Yeah, I think it makes a ton of sense and really can change the discussion from a dropped idea to a past one. So if we agree on the ending (canon wise anyway) can we address their beginning?

Why go for Spacers? Why not go for a percentage of the total population directly under the orders of the ilKhan and working for the Clans as a whole?

Good questions Ice, that bring us back to the start of the concept and to be clear the Guilds could embrace both a terrestrial contingent as well as a spacer culture. Don't think one bans the other.

1. Spacers of the InnerSphere. This culture exists where the Clans came from and in a spacefaring society why wouldn't it here? I could also add the higher tech base of the Clans and their travel among the Homeworlds (which themselves are poorly habitable) necissate a more vigorous space infrastructure. Think IceShips and basic terraforming supplies needed to keep these planets habitable.

2. Long Journey that never ended. It is my contention that the long journey from the InnerSphere to the Pentagon Worlds would have forever changed some people. Might some of those embrace a spacer mindset and their style of living over this period to the point where they no longer wish to live on planet? From naval families split during the Coup and were too horrorified to ever go back to folks who work there for a living to those who just plain old like the experience better and never want to leave. I think this is very plausible.

3. Evacuation of the Pentagon. The death of Alexander Kerensky was a sudden event as was the Second Exodus of his son. As you will see in my next point Pentagon spacers did already exist and Nicholas would need help to evacute 'loyalists' from the Pentagon to Strana Mechty. This is the event where my spacers earn their place in Clan society helping ferry away (think Dunkirk style) Nicky's civilians and equipment while his military assets were occupied in a fighting withdraw. Recognizing the continuing value of these Free Guilders to the Clans as a whole they became something of a 21st Clan to me.

4. Spacers during the Pentagon Civil War. Thanks to the Historical we see evidence of many of these civilizations especially upon their return to via Operation Klondike.

5. Canon Evidence. From the shared Strana Mechty dropship yards (Union and Overlord IIC) to their mentions in the Jade Falcon SB which has to do with shipping to mention that the Jaguars need Grand Council approval to go into a naval cache to activate replace ships after the Mongoose Absorption could indicate as marauder648 suggests an existence of a group to safeguard fragile facilities, space facilities. As the Succession Wars showed in the InnerSphere these are extremely vulnerable to big damage.

What do you think??
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marauder648

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Re: Free Guilds = Clan Spacers
« Reply #10 on: November 28, 2019, 10:42:25 AM »

I like these ideas, perhaps because divvying up the spacer's who supported them would cause ructions and arguments and been a logistic nightmare the spacers and their ilk who supported Nicky K in Exodus II electric boogaloo and KLONDYKE are granted a form of autononmy. Their loyalty is to the civilization he wants to build and to the ilKhan and Grand Council. In return  they are protected by the warriors and their industrial endeavours and resources will be traded for by the Clans. They have to impliment some form of Caste system, sans the Warriors.
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Takiro

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Re: Free Guilds = Clan Spacers
« Reply #11 on: November 28, 2019, 11:17:39 AM »

Thank you, don't forget that when the Clans are forming these fragile space industries under the care of the Guild and production shared evenly with all Clans are the last of their kind. Nothing else remains of the space infrastructure bought in with the Exodus. Placing these cllective assets in the Guilds care as a reserve that the Clans could not touch individually would be wise and necessary.

I wanted to thank you for the next question which was born out of your comments yesterday. Did the decline in the ilKhan office mark the start of isolation for the Free Guilds?
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marauder648

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Re: Free Guilds = Clan Spacers
« Reply #12 on: November 28, 2019, 11:46:40 AM »

Thank you, don't forget that when the Clans are forming these fragile space industries under the care of the Guild and production shared evenly with all Clans are the last of their kind. Nothing else remains of the space infrastructure bought in with the Exodus. Placing these cllective assets in the Guilds care as a reserve that the Clans could not touch individually would be wise and necessary.

I wanted to thank you for the next question which was born out of your comments yesterday. Did the decline in the ilKhan office mark the start of isolation for the Free Guilds?

Hrm....probably not. Remember the ilKhan was answerable to the Grand Council, only one ilKhan was above that, Nicky K himself. And when he got a gauss slug in the face, the role was forever diminished and changed from being dictator to headmaster/headmistress trying to control 20 unruly childeren.

I'd say that because the successive ilKhans or Grand Council seemed to have not really stamped down on the Free Guilds then they'd have no problem remaining loyal. If they started putting pressure on them then they'd probably leave but the Khans are not stupid enough to risk loosing their orbital facilities and experience or the majority of their asteroid mining operations etc. You could have even has Nicky K swearing that they would NEVER be tampered with and thus basically making that a law that the other Khans would be unwilling to ever tamper with or go against.

Basically the Free Guilds have a good thing going on. Trade on tap, protection from Dark Caste, and they sit beyond the politics and squabbling of the Clans.

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Takiro

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Re: Free Guilds = Clan Spacers
« Reply #13 on: November 28, 2019, 02:55:24 PM »

Trying to write their history and it is sort of though cause after the Pentagon up to the start of Revival is a blank slate. The corruption of ilKhan Tobias Khatib would be a usable bullet point to focus on. Conflict with the other Clans is difficult as the have no warriors.

I did plan for a Guildmaster as their leader, a Guild Council as the law maker, and a Guild Keshik to police them composed of warriors of all the Clans.
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marauder648

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Re: Free Guilds = Clan Spacers
« Reply #14 on: November 28, 2019, 04:10:40 PM »

Aye perhaps Tobias ordered the Free Guild to funnel more resources to his Clan and they just did so, ilKhan after all and after he was removed then they came in for a bit more oversight?  A Guildmaster would be their Khan equivalent, but would have no vote on the Council.
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