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Author Topic: Quicksilver Decisions  (Read 30170 times)

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Takiro

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Quicksilver Decisions
« on: July 14, 2014, 11:13:32 PM »
Hey folks, as the Quicksilver contests continue there are certain log jams in production that have to be resolved and I wanted to get your input. Since the manufacturing and industrial capacity of the Clans is being tested at this time it is necessary to cull some canon designs that duplicate our three roles from certain weight categories. Quicksilver has augmented the Clans as a whole by dictating a certain level of cooperation for the good of renewed operations against the InnerSphere which must of course be defeated. With their combined production strength thanks to more uniting of individual Clans efforts extra capacity has been created but there is still a shortfall and sacrifices have to be made. I figure with so many new designs coming online cuts have to be made anyways as the Clans must make do with limited resources.

First off at 40 tons is a log jam with 5 designs for 3 spots. The Battle Cobra is your clear Zombie at 40 tons with a 240 engine (6/9) and 14 tons pod space. This leaves the Coyotl [40 tons, 280XL (7/11), 15.5 tons] to face off against the Pouncer [40 tons, 240XL (6/9/5), 15.5 tons pod space] for the Assailant or Vampire but I suppose the Pouncer would be the easy winner.

After all production of the Coyotl has been halted for quite sometime but brings up another point, availability of spare parts for any ceased machines. Would the Clans still produce limited numbers of replacement parts or no? I suppose there is a fair degree of generic parts thanks to Omni designing. So could the Coyotl and other halted Mechs still appear with frequency on the battlefield?

For 40 ton Speedster or Werewolf there is the Phantom [40 tons, 360XL (9/14), 6.5 tons] squaring off against the Viper (aka the Dragonfly) [40 tons, 320XL, (8/12/8), 8.5 tons]. I am almost inclined to halt one of Clan Wolf's newest OmniMechs because it would show the ilKhan's own sacrifice for the Quicksilver initiative but it would rapidly see that design go extinct as so few exist. Which do you think is the better choice?
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JPArbiter

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Re: Quicksilver Decisions
« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2014, 11:40:21 PM »
the Coytol has been out of production and while Omnipods can serve, spare parts are nonexistant, the Puncer wins.  as far as the Phantom and Viper... Trial of Position it.  Personally I favor the Dragonfly for it's maneuverability, and heavier weaponry, but I know the Pouncer has its own champions.

the discontinuation of the Viper could help or hurt the society cause.  it could help by giving them access to a large pool of suddenly unused components that would promote the eventual development of the Cephalus, it could hurt cause Mech production has to be hidden, and tapping out those parts would make it hard to keep production hidden.
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Dragon Cat

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Re: Quicksilver Decisions
« Reply #2 on: July 15, 2014, 12:35:50 AM »
Quote from: JPArbiter on July 14, 2014, 11:40:21 PM
the Coytol has been out of production and while Omnipods can serve, spare parts are nonexistant, the Puncer wins.  as far as the Phantom and Viper... Trial of Position it.  Personally I favor the Dragonfly for it's maneuverability, and heavier weaponry, but I know the Pouncer has its own champions.


I'd agree with both the Coytol is/was a prototype it belonged in a museum

The Dragonfly is ugly as sin but better than that Pouncer
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Quote from: ColBosch on March 15, 2015, 05:35:30 PM

Really, as long as there is an unbroken line of people calling themselves "Clan Nova Cat," it doesn't really matter to me if they're still using Iron Wombs or not. They may be dead as a faction, but as a people they still exist. It's not uncommon in the real world, after all.

masterarminas

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Re: Quicksilver Decisions
« Reply #3 on: July 15, 2014, 12:38:32 AM »
Pouncer for the first.  JPArbiter is absolutely right . . . the Coytl is a dead design, all but extinct and no longer in production.

For the second . . . tell the truth, I prefer the Viper.  First of all, Clan Ghost Bear is fluffed as fielding large numbers of this 'Mech and while it does have problems with existing weapon configs, the Phantom has even more (especially with the 12 fixed DHS that it does not need for virtually ANY of its configurations).

MA
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Abele

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Re: Quicksilver Decisions
« Reply #4 on: July 15, 2014, 01:37:00 AM »
sound decisions on both choices. Heck, I wouldn't have considered the Coyotl as part of the conversation due to its age.
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drakensis

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Re: Quicksilver Decisions
« Reply #5 on: July 15, 2014, 01:45:08 AM »
Pouncer and Viper. No question.
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Blacknova

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Re: Quicksilver Decisions
« Reply #6 on: July 15, 2014, 03:57:03 AM »
Why not start a poll, for a week for each decision?  You might get a few more votes than just comments from those involved in the design process.
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Takiro

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Re: Quicksilver Decisions
« Reply #7 on: July 15, 2014, 06:42:57 AM »
I considered a poll question Blacknova but I want to get more input then just a simple vote for one design over the other. What do you think? Pouncer or Coyotl? Phantom or Viper?

I always found it funny that the Viper is a Fire Mandrill / Ghost Bear creation, you'd think the Steel Vipers would have something to do with it.

Quote from: Dragon Cat on July 15, 2014, 12:35:50 AM
The Dragonfly is ugly as sin but better than that Pouncer

I hear you Dragon Cat but the real choice is between the Phantom or the Viper as both of those contests bring the speed to the 40 ton frame for the Clans. So which is it for you the Phantom or Viper?

Just thinking about it we'd already have a jumper with the Pouncer - is adding the Viper overkill? Just trying to help the poor Phantom out a little bit.
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Blacknova

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Re: Quicksilver Decisions
« Reply #8 on: July 15, 2014, 08:04:34 AM »
Fair enough, but commmenters will still comment on a poll, just ups the input through votes was my thinking. 

Can you ask me again in the morning, I'm not as think as you drunk I am at that moment?
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Dragon Cat

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Re: Quicksilver Decisions
« Reply #9 on: July 15, 2014, 08:37:23 AM »
Quote from: Takiro on July 15, 2014, 06:42:57 AM
I considered a poll question Blacknova but I want to get more input then just a simple vote for one design over the other. What do you think? Pouncer or Coyotl? Phantom or Viper?

I always found it funny that the Viper is a Fire Mandrill / Ghost Bear creation, you'd think the Steel Vipers would have something to do with it.

Quote from: Dragon Cat on July 15, 2014, 12:35:50 AM
The Dragonfly is ugly as sin but better than that Pouncer

I hear you Dragon Cat but the real choice is between the Phantom or the Viper as both of those contests bring the speed to the 40 ton frame for the Clans. So which is it for you the Phantom or Viper?

Just thinking about it we'd already have a jumper with the Pouncer - is adding the Viper overkill? Just trying to help the poor Phantom out a little bit.

For me it's Viper all the way the Viper acts like a harraser its an ugly Mech but its mobile and it is packed with weapons from the word Configuration.  IMO the Phantom is an over-sized scout.

As for Jump Jets - you can never have enough Mechs with Jump Jets.  The Viper uses them properly to get over obstacles and bring its firepower to bear as quickly as possible.
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Quote from: ColBosch on March 15, 2015, 05:35:30 PM

Really, as long as there is an unbroken line of people calling themselves "Clan Nova Cat," it doesn't really matter to me if they're still using Iron Wombs or not. They may be dead as a faction, but as a people they still exist. It's not uncommon in the real world, after all.

Takiro

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Re: Quicksilver Decisions
« Reply #10 on: July 15, 2014, 11:58:44 AM »
Well another voter for the Viper over the Phantom.  It seems like the Pouncer and the Viper are the unanimous choice.

Quote from: Blacknovalink=topic=2647.msg35974#msg35974 date=1405425874
Can you ask me again in the morning, I'm not as think as you drunk I am at that moment?

Got you Nova, comment when your hangover has worn off mate.

Anyone else? 
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Abele

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Re: Quicksilver Decisions
« Reply #11 on: July 15, 2014, 12:43:30 PM »
The 45-ton range seems to be croded as well. The Ice Ferret and Grendel fill the Werewolf role, while the Shadow Cat can fill the assailant role, so that leaves us with the Zombie for that weight
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Takiro

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Re: Quicksilver Decisions
« Reply #12 on: July 15, 2014, 04:38:24 PM »
Quote from: Abele on July 15, 2014, 12:43:30 PM
The 45-ton range seems to be croded as well. The Ice Ferret and Grendel fill the Werewolf role, while the Shadow Cat can fill the assailant role, so that leaves us with the Zombie for that weight

Yup that is the next issue Abele at 45 tons.

The Ice Ferret (Fenris) introduced by Clan Wolf in 2948 is the oldest and fastest design (360XL makes it go 8/12) among this group. The engine is an interesting point cause it can be used on several upcoming designs including the Black Mamba (or the Blood Asp as it is known in canon). The 7.5 tons of Ferro Fibrous armor plating give the same armor value of 144 that the Mongrel has which is greater than the Shadow Cat. However 9.5 tons of pod space is pretty light for weapons and equipment.
The Ice Ferret is definitely a Werewolf or Speedster type OmniMech but is age and the fact that this machine lacks mobility (jump jets) be its downfall?

Next we have the Mongrel (Grendel) which debuted at the Battle of Tukayyid with Clan Diamond Shark. While it won't enter full scale production till next year (3053) this OmniMech could fill either the Werewolf (Speedster) or Vampire (Assailant) types for the 45 ton weight range. Its 315 XL engine gives the capable of 7/11 speed which when added to the mobility of 7 integral jump jets make it quite formidable. It possesses the same 7.5 tons of Ferro Fibrous that give it an armor value of 144 identical to the Ice Ferret and slightly more than the Shadow Cat. 13.5 tons of pod space is a clear advantage over the Ice Ferret but is less than the Shadow Cat. So this machine could compete with both the Ice Ferret and the Shadow Cat for either role within the Clans touman. Or could the Sharks poor performance on Tukayyid doom this new design?

Finally the Shadow Cat first produced by Clan Nova Cat in 3003 is a very capable design probably my favorite in the 45 ton weight range. Certainly this is a Vampire (Assailant) type machine with a 270 XL engine providing it a 6/9 movement profile combined with 6 jump jets for extra mobility. While this OmniMech features the lowest amount of protection with 7 tons of Ferro Fibrous armor plating giving it an armor value of 134 that is not its strength. 17 tons of pod space make this a dangerous Medium weight opponent on the battlefield. Could it be overcome by the Mongrel??

So yes while Quicksilver 7 will address the need for a Zombie at this weight class but lets not jump ahead of ourselves. What would your choice be and tell me why.

1. Is it the Ice Ferret or the Mongrel for the Werewolf (Speedster) role?

2. is it the Mongrel or the Shadow Cat for the Vampire (Assailant) role?
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masterarminas

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Re: Quicksilver Decisions
« Reply #13 on: July 15, 2014, 04:58:01 PM »
1.  Ice Ferret.

2.  Shadow Cat.

Don't get me wrong, I love the Mongrel . . . but it lies in no-man's-land between the two.  Neither a Speedster nor an Assailant it be, but a jack-of-all-trades.  C'est la vie.

MA
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Dragon Cat

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Re: Quicksilver Decisions
« Reply #14 on: July 15, 2014, 05:09:29 PM »
Quote from: masterarminas on July 15, 2014, 04:58:01 PM
1.  Ice Ferret.

2.  Shadow Cat.

Don't get me wrong, I love the Mongrel . . . but it lies in no-man's-land between the two.  Neither a Speedster nor an Assailant it be, but a jack-of-all-trades.  C'est la vie.

MA

I'd go for the same given those choices the Ice Ferret has the speed to make up for Jump Jets.  While the Shadow Cat is easily my favourite medium Clanner and one of my all time favourite Mechs it has the mobility with the speed, MASC and jump jets and it can carry some mean firepower.  The A configuration I find is particularly effective
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My stuff, and my AU timeline follow link and enjoy

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The original CBT thread
Dragon Cat on CBT

Quote from: ColBosch on March 15, 2015, 05:35:30 PM

Really, as long as there is an unbroken line of people calling themselves "Clan Nova Cat," it doesn't really matter to me if they're still using Iron Wombs or not. They may be dead as a faction, but as a people they still exist. It's not uncommon in the real world, after all.
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