Topic: Phoenix Class Carrier (Read 6566 times)

lrose · « **on:** July 16, 2011, 09:36:33 PM »

Phoenix Class Carrier
In Service: 2533
Type: Military Spheroid
Mass: 14,800 tons
Thrust: 6/9
Fuel: 1400 tons
SI: 12
Armor: 43 tons
   Nose: 182
   Sides: 162
   Aft: 144
Heatsinks: 198
Fighters: 24
Crew: 4 officers, 24 crew, 48 2nd class passengers
Lifeboats: 4
Escape Pods: 6
Cargo: 2,786 tons
Bays:
   Bay 1: 8 Fighters (2 doors)
   Bay 2: 8 Fighters (2 doors)
   Bay 3: 8 Fighters (2 doors)
   Bay 4: Cargo (4 doors)
Weapons:
Nose:
4 PPCs
2 Medium Lasers

FR/FL:
2 PPCs
4 Medium Lasers

AR/AL:
4 Medium Lasers

Aft
2 PPCs
2 Medium Lasers

Overview:
In 2530 the Concordat Navy began looking for a new carrier dropship to support their Concordat class frigates. While the Concordat typically carried 2 Pegasus class carriers, there was a desire for a new, larger ship capable of carrying an entire Air Division. After studying several options, the Concordat navy settled on a design based on the Transhauler cargo ship, one of the so-called â€œJumboâ€ class dropships. While this choice imposed some limitations on the new design, the ready availability of replacement parts was too appealing to the Navy. The new ship entered service with the Concordat Navy starting in 2533 and by the time of the Reunification War was a mainstay of the Taurian fleet.

Capabilities:
The Phoenix class is designed to carry an entire division of 24 fighters. The entire design of the ship is optimized to support those planes. While most carriers do not provide much in the way of accommodations for their pilots and maintenance crews, the Phoenix provides small, but comfortable double occupancy cabins for them. The ship also has a large fuel bunker and spacious cargo bay, which ensures the ship can carry enough supplies for extended operations.

The originally request for the new carrier called for above average thrust capacity. Rather then design a new drive for the ship, the designers simply mounted two the Transhaulers RJ-7 Drives, providing twice the thrust. This allows the Phoenix to generate up to 4.5G's of thrust. The engines were slightly tweaked by the design team, resulting in better fuel efficiency.

The designers also improved the firepower and protection of the ship. The armor protection was increased by approximately a third. The weapons were also upgraded. The ammo dependent autocannons were removed and each autocannon turret was replaced with a pair of PPCs. Some additional medium lasers were added to cover the sides of the ship and 2 PPCs were placed to cover the ship's aft side.

Despite all of the changes made to the Transhauler to turn it into a carrier, the designers were able to reduce the crew of the ship by almost a third. The space that was freed up was used to add recreational areas and an improved mess, making duty on the ship more enjoyable for the crew.

Deployment:
The Phoenix has been deployed in large numbers with the Concordat Navy. Typically 2 are assigned to every Concordat class frigate and it is not uncommon to see these vessels assigned to the Dart and Winchester cruisers. The Phoenix also forms the backbone of many planetary defense flotillas, providing fighter coverage for the assault ships assigned to the flotillas.

During the Reunification War, the Phoenix class saw heavy action against the Star League Defense Forces. While the ship was ill-suited for use as an assault ship, the Phoenix's Air Division was a powerful force. In many cases the fighters carried by the Phoenix would turn the tide of battle and inflict heavy losses on the SLDF.

Hessian · « **Reply #1 on:** July 17, 2011, 11:38:05 AM »

Nice!

Ciao
Hessian

Halvagor · « **Reply #2 on:** July 18, 2011, 10:23:23 PM »

Converting the Jumbo, hmm? It's got the room, certainly. Sticking in the second engine, however, well, I think that'd mess with the structural integrity, myself. The ship clearly wasn't designed with that sort of thing in mind. But such is a fluff issue, and one commonly ignored in such significant modifications, because it (strangely) isn't an issue for BattleMechs, where an engine takes up the same internal volume regardless of whether it's a 120-rated engine making a 40-tonner go 3/5 or a 240-rated in that same 40-tonner with twice for twice the speed.

Otherwise...you didn't include gunners in your crew breakdown, but it comes out to five. Assuming you don't want to add more officers, that makes 4 officers, 19 crew, 5 gunners. You're working a far more complex ship with only 60% of the crew from the civilian version; given that clunky systems were said to be why the Jumbo needed a large crew to begin with, I think it makes a better "feel" if you have to increase the ship's crew much better. Little known fact, but merchant sailors are traditionally more highly skilled than naval personnel, at least at the tasks actually related to making ships move about. But naval vessels are far more complex and require much more maintenance, and thus the much, much larger crews despite the much, much smaller ships. To crew the Phoenix at about the same level as the Jumbo, I estimate you'd need about 9 officers, 40 crew, and 5 gunners, costing another 197 tons, but since you had 2786.5 to play with, there's plenty to steal from.

I'd also consider throwing in some small craft bays. 6-8. Possibly also some Marines, so the Phoenix can assist in customs duties during peacetime and help suppress piracy at all times. 30 Marines would cost another 210 tons, and 6 small craft bays would eat another 1200, but there's still 1239.5 left. Nice thing about small craft, they also give you an excuse not to increase the escape pod/life boat numbers. Throw out another 65 tons for food & water, 148 for 1% spare parts, and there's 1026.5 remaining.

Does the Phoenix need more than two years worth of fuel at 1 gravity, when the Concordat has enough fuel for 63 days? Probably not. Still, five times as much fuel, to allow for a more active DropShip and account for fueling the fighters, seems fine, which would cut the fuel to about 600 tons, pushing another 816 tons to cargo, for 1842.5 tons total (2055.5 if you don't divide out the food & water or spare parts). Which is pretty impressive for a dropship carrying so many fighters. Though if I were a Phoenix captain, I'd be using the DropShip's speed to stay away from enemy assault droppers & the full range of heavy fighters.

lrose · « **Reply #3 on:** July 19, 2011, 08:50:42 AM »

Just to clarify- the Phoenix is a new construction hull based on the "Jumbo"- not a retrofit of existing Jumbos. So fitting the second engine in is easier because they can modify the structure to accommodate the "larger" engine.

Quote

You're working a far more complex ship with only 60% of the crew from the civilian version; given that clunky systems were said to be why the Jumbo needed a large crew to begin with, I think it makes a better "feel" if you have to increase the ship's crew much better.

That's not exactly what H:RW says:

Quote

They all had massive cargo capacities and were also all relatively hardy ships built to survive rough handling as well as limited combat operations

and

Quote

They
ruled the space lanes for more than two centuries before advances in naval design and automation made newer designs with smaller crews and more reliable engines far more cost effective to operate.

During their time, the Jumbos are described as hardy. It is when they are compared to the more modern Mule that they appear clunky. What got left out of the fluff is that the designers used increased automation to reduce crew requirements on the ship. That was what I was thinking when I wrote the entry but I did not put it in the fluff.

I did think about put small craft on the design but ultimately decided against it-I just felt that it didn't fit with how the Concordat saw the design. Customs duties I think fall under the Concordat Constabulary and the navy does not want their ships tasked with that role. And while the ship was originally intended to serve with the Concordat Frigates as it was being developed the Concordat Navy saw the design being deployed in huge numbers to planetary defense flotillas as well as other warships. In most cases they didn't see a need to deploy marines, who wants to tie up valuable zero-g marines in a little backwater- so they decided not to carry any small craft bays or accommodations for marines.

And I agree if I were a Phoenix captain I would use my engines to keep away from the enemy- that's why the ship carries a relatively weak weapons array- mainly meant for defense against any fighters that do catch up to it.

Halvagor · « **Reply #4 on:** July 19, 2011, 08:49:15 PM »

In my opinion, we're not saying different things re: the Jumbo's systems; "hardy" equipment is very often "clunky," as most "efficient" systems tend to be fragile, on account of being over-engineered. Remember, too, that "limited combat operations" in the Age of War was not the same as it was in the Succession Wars, since that was a time of true maneuver warfare, making war more like chess than like paintball. Or rather, more like 17th century warfare than WWII. Less destruction all around, and logistics vehicles could afford to be chartered civilian vessels rather than specialized military ones.

If you're going to use these for planetary defense, then it becomes even easier to drastically shrink the fuel size in favor of either more cargo or other craft. If you don't want Marines & boarding craft, you can still have combat-capable small craft to increase the Jumbo's throw-weight (since its main battery, like all good carriers, is its AeroSpace units). I think any that do end up with the Concordats would still benefit from a platoon of Marines & a couple boarding craft, if only to make it easier for the Concordat Navy to capture more SLN and AFFS ships. And if I were captain of a Concordat, I'd really want at least one of these to increase the cargo volume my ship (and its DropShips) could carry.

lrose · « **Reply #5 on:** July 20, 2011, 12:18:06 AM »

Alright you convinced me on the need for small craft- here's the revised Phoenix.

Phoenix Class Carrier
In Service: 2533
Type: Military Spheroid
Mass: 14,800 tons
Thrust: 6/9
Fuel: 1000 tons
SI: 12
Armor: 43 tons
   Nose: 182
   Sides: 162
   Aft: 144
Heatsinks: 198
Fighters: 24
Small Craft: 4
Crew: 4 officers, 24 crew, 94 2nd class passengers
Lifeboats: 8
Escape Pods: 10
Cargo: 2,016 tons
Bays:
   Bay 1: Fighters (24) 4 doors
   Bay 2: Small Craft (4) 2 doors
   Bay 3: Cargo 4 doors
Weapons:
Nose:
4 PPCs
2 Medium Lasers

FR/FL:
2 PPCs
4 Medium Lasers

AR/AL:
4 Medium Lasers

Aft
2 PPCs
2 Medium Lasers

Overview:
In 2530 the Concordat Navy began looking for a new carrier dropship to support their Concordat class frigates. While the Concordat typically carried 2 Pegasus class carriers, there was a desire for a new, larger ship capable of carrying an entire Air Division. After studying several options, the Concordat navy settled on a design based on the Transhauler cargo ship, one of the so-called â€œJumboâ€ class dropships. While this choice imposed some limitations on the new design, the ready availability of replacement parts was too appealing to the Navy. The new ship entered service with the Concordat Navy starting in 2533 and by the time of the Reunification War was a mainstay of the Taurian fleet.

Capabilities:
The Phoenix class is designed to carry an entire division of 24 fighters. The entire design of the ship is optimized to support those planes. While most carriers do not provide much in the way of accommodations for their pilots and maintenance crews, the Phoenix provides small, but comfortable double occupancy cabins for them. The ship also has a large fuel bunker and spacious cargo bay, which ensures the ship can carry enough supplies for extended operations.

In addition to the fighter bays, the Phoenix can carry 4 small craft. Depending on the situation the ship can carry either heavily armed escort craft or boarding shuttles for marine assault teams. The ship has room to carry an entire platoon of Marines in 15 double occupancy cabins. Typically unless the ship expects to see action against enemy fleets, the Marines are not carried and the cabins are used to house additional technical personal for the ship fighters and small craft.

The original request for the new carrier called for above average thrust capacity. Rather then design a new drive for the ship, the designers simply mounted two of the Transhauler's RJ-7 Drives, providing twice the thrust. This allows the Phoenix to generate up to 4.5G's of thrust. The engines were slightly tweaked by the design team, resulting in better fuel efficiency.

While the main weapons of the Phoenix are its fighter craft, the designers did not neglect the ships armor and weapons. While standard doctrine calls for the Phoenix to remain back and away from the enemy forces, there is always the chance that the ship will be caught in a situation where it will have no choice but to engage the enemy directly. To give the Phoenix a better chance at survival, the armor was increased by approximately a third over that of the Transhauler. The weapon systems were also upgraded. The ammo dependent autocannons were removed and each autocannon turret was replaced with a pair of PPCs. Some additional medium lasers were added to cover the sides of the ship and 2 PPCs were placed to cover the ship's aft side.

Despite all of the changes made to the Transhauler to turn it into a carrier, the designers were able to reduce the crew of the ship by almost a third, largely through advances in automation. The space that was freed up was used to add recreational areas and an improved mess, making duty on the ship more enjoyable for the crew.

Deployment:
The Phoenix has been deployed in large numbers with the Concordat Navy. Typically 2 are assigned to every Concordat class frigate and it is not uncommon to see these vessels assigned to the Dart and Winchester cruisers. The Phoenix also forms the backbone of many planetary defense flotillas, providing fighter coverage for the assault ships assigned to the flotillas.

During the Reunification War, the Phoenix class saw heavy action against the Star League Defense Forces. While the ship was ill-suited for use as an assault ship, the Phoenix's Air Division was a powerful force. In many cases the fighters carried by the Phoenix would turn the tide of battle and inflict heavy losses on the SLDF.

Halvagor · « **Reply #6 on:** July 20, 2011, 12:43:27 AM »

I think that'll be a much more powerful design for the Taurians, given how hard most heavy escorts are to destroy. If nothing else, they might take some weapons-fire intended for the frigate. Happy hunting to them, as two of these pretty much put a Concordat on par with a New Syrtis when it comes to fighter capacity.

OBT Forum

News:

Author Topic: Phoenix Class Carrier (Read 6566 times)

lrose

Phoenix Class Carrier

Hessian

Re: Phoenix Class Carrier

Halvagor

Re: Phoenix Class Carrier

lrose

Re: Phoenix Class Carrier

Halvagor

Re: Phoenix Class Carrier

lrose

Re: Phoenix Class Carrier

Halvagor

Re: Phoenix Class Carrier