OBT Forum

Ultimately, I think it all comes down to Perceived Cost VS Perceived Benefit.

Note, this is NOT real Cost vs Benefit but the perceptions of both.

This  also does not only include the C-Bill costs, but the manpower costs, opportunity costs, and perceived strategic benefits.

So long as the micro-states can portray themselves as not worth the time/effort to take, they will remain potentially viable.  As soon as that equation shifts and a neighbor is capable....they are meat.

What about without having ComStar recognition? Keeping mind, for example, the Indy worlds in the former FWL have no such recognition.

What areas of the Inner Sphere do you guys think couldn't enjoy micro states or independent worlds of any kind?

To your second question...none. Anywhere in the Sphere could have micro states. Just about every faction that I can think of has a clearly purpose built "fifth column" type group.

This is personal opinion, but do you beleive there's a single location in the Inner Sphere where the planets are simply to important that in the presence of a large state or collection of micro-states independent worlds wouldn't exist?

This question is also for anyone willing to jump in.

And, thanks again to everyone for participating in the conversation. It is greatly appreciated.

Thanks Dread.

Anyone else? I'd love to hear from Klink, MadCap, any of the Hexare or KU guys.

Any new member out there willing to throw a little opinion my way? It's appreciated.

I agree with Ronin; it's not location which drives inclusion into larger states, but the resources a given world brings to the table, real or perceived.  Tikonov is an excellent example.  Sun Tzu Liao made a point of recovering it early for both the prestige taking it away from Davion provided, as well as for the fact that its heavily industrialized economy would be a significant boon to the resurgent Capellan Confederation.  The fact that it was far from the rest of the nation, and that we might suspect its supply chain was severely disrupted by switching sides were costs considered worth the benefits.

But, clearly by design, each central power of the Inner Sphere has its separatist elements, several of them have more than one.  It's clearly part of interstellar feudalism, because otherwise there's little explanation for why the successor lords allow such internal division of vision & opinion.

Equally, a world between two powers might well find itself being fought over because it is strategically placed whereas a world that happens to be isolated may be granted the opportunity to remain independent because no one near it considers it a priority.

Using the FWL region as an example, let's compare the maps from 3085 to 3130.

Firstly, did the neighbours move in at all?
Answer: yes. The Lyran Commonwealth, even before Melissa Steiner II launched her invasion, appears to have pushed the border thirty light years or so and mostly at the expense of Tamarind-Abbey. The Capellan Commonwealth seems to have made a push for several worlds between Oriente and Andurien before their borders made contact, generally picking up independent worlds (and given the history, certainly ones that were once part of the Confederation anyway). Interestingly the Marians don't seem to have pushed in since the abortive invasion in the immediate post-jihad but the Canopians have taken a couple of worlds, securing a link to their Capellan allies.

Secondly, did the major provinces expand at the expense of their smaller neighbours?
Again, yes, although it seems to have been mid-sized polities that suffered the most. Of twelve multi-world polities in 3085, only six survive in 3130 and all six that vanished were absorbed by a larger neighbour. Only the Rim Commonality and Tamarind-Abbey have not done this, but that's probably lack of opportunity more than anything. Small multi-world polities were large enough that they could pose a long term threat, small enough to be annexable and could reasonably be absorbed as a lump whereas each independent world would need to be fought for (as opposed to pressuring a ruler to fold all their worlds into your realm at once).

What independent worlds were absorbed? Looking at each of the six survivor realms of the FWL in turn:
Andurien has expanded considerably, moving into worlds bordering the Capellans, Canopians and Oriente but not deeper into the relatively large number of independent worlds seperating them from the Regulans.
The Marik-Stewart Commonwealth has actually lost a few worlds but expanded towards the Lyran border as well as towards Oriente. This seems to be more firming up their border than any particular expansionary goal.
Oriente has expanded right along the Capellan border, presumably to prevent further opportunism by Sun-Tzu and his heirs. They've also picked off several neighbours facing the MSC and Regulans though, leaving only a modest buffer against both. What they haven't done is try to bolster the border with the Republic.
The Regulan Fiefs, interestingly, have expanded away from their major neighbours. Certainly they weren't having much luck against Oriente in the post-jihad era but in general they seem to be expansionary but largely only succeeding against the weaker independent worlds they can pick off one at a time.
The Rim Commonality seems to have expanded along the edge of the periphery, but not inwards towards the Regulans, suggesting that they prefer to leave a comfortable buffer zone.
Tamarind-Abbey expanded along the Lyran border and towards the Marians, suggesting that they were trying to firm up their borders with both powers and prevent further expansion into FWL space.

In most cases therefore, expansion has been aimed at countering and competing with the other large players. Independent worlds which are isolated have largely been left alone presumably on the basis that no one is willing to risk a major push to take them if it means directing attention and resources away from dealing with states that can threaten them.

Also the pace has been quite slow. As Field Manual 3085 indicates, rapid campaigns across dozens of worlds have gone out of fashion for a generation or more, replaced with lower intensity clashes over a single world, manuvering scant and precious military resources to secure an advantage without risking serious losses. As a result, worlds without immediate large neighbours are less at risk.

Another aspect to take into account is whether or not the resulting micro states have access to more military resources/industries.
Different reasons can explain this focus but it might shift the power balance between the different states.